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Title: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Spy on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 09:21:36 Leaving aside whether you think we'd do well in the playoffs. Assuming we could get either.
Which do you think would be best for the club? I tend to think going up via the playoffs is best for the club because of the extra money generated and the extra excitement for the fans. Think it could boost attendences for next year and give us more of a feel good factor going into pre-season/next season. Automatic promotion could be seen as better as it's more prestigious - you finished higher and didn't need to go through the playoffs. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: STFC_Gazza on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 09:27:21 Fuck that, Automatic Promotion, playoffs are a lottery. WE will get bigger crowds if we go up anyway (mainly in part to away team followings) and the names of the clubs in that division will get bigger gates. Probably looking about 9,500 average I would think?
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Gnasher on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 09:27:56 Difficult one. The money from the extra game and Wembley will help. But automatic gives you an extra month of season ticket sales at Championship prices.
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Spy on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 09:31:31 Fuck that, Automatic Promotion, playoffs are a lottery. Gazza you didn't get the poll. I'm saying assume we WOULD win at Wembley. The choice is between going up by winning the playoffs or going up automatic. Leave aside all that "playoffs are a lottery" stuff. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Colin Todd on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 09:35:41 I'm sure I read on here that the play off gate receipts get distributed around all 4 teams so the finanical benefit of winning the play offs isnt as great as you might think.
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Spy on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 09:36:52 I'm sure I read on here that the play off gate receipts get distributed around all 4 teams so the finanical benefit of winning the play offs isnt as great as you might think. But surely ticket sales for Wembley aren't split with the losing semi finalists?!? Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Colin Todd on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 09:51:04 Unless I've made it up in my head I think they are. Did Jonny72 post it?
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Colin Todd on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 09:54:32 Jonny72:
Quote I found this document on the Football League website which covers the 2006/7 play offs; http://www.football-league.co.uk/staticFiles/ba/91/0,,10794~37306,00.pdf Basically; - Semi Finals: 50% of the gate receipts goes in to the pool account (which I think is shared out amongst all clubs in the division). The other 50% goes in to a pool, division by division, which is then shared out between the 4 clubs in the play offs. So each club in the play offs gets 12.5% of the total gate receipts for the 4 semi finals. - Finals: 50% goes in to the pool account. The other 50% is shared by the 2 clubs in the final. Programme sales and perimeter advertising are viewed included in the gate receipts. - TV Money: Looks like this is not viewed as being any part of the proceeds of the games. So about £150k in gate receipts for the semi finals and £300k for the final (both based on 60k at £20). Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: pauld on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 10:33:25 I answered play-off win although by a tight margin on the basis that would be marginally better for the club, not just the revenue but the extra exposure, feel-good factor, re-engaging loads of plastics who might then be persuaded to come along next season etc.
But by Christ I'd rather go up auto Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Spy on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 10:43:24 Similarly to Pauld I voted playoff win as for the reasons already stated I agree it's better for the club. BUT I too would probably prefer automatic. Get it done and dusted and avoid the stress of the playoffs. Going to those 3 games (or even just the home leg and the final) would hit me quite hard financially too. Having said that if we thrashed Leeds a third time at Wembley I'm sure it'd ALL be worth it. :D
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: jonny72 on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 10:54:23 Now we're in the playoffs I don't mind too much how the season ends as there is a positive side to all outcomes.
- Automatic would be an incredible achievement and means Championship football next season. - Promotion via the playoffs means a winning trip to Wembley, more money for the club and Championship football next season. - Not getting promoted means two or three edge of your seat games, some extra money for the club and (in theory) another good season next year with us challenging for the title in League One - if we improve the squad the way we did over the last 12 months then we'd have a very good chance. So its all good. Though it doesn't mean I won't get upset and moan if we do fuck it up though. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: pauld on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 10:58:14 The thing that most concerns me about the play-off route is the danger of what is currently a very good squad breaking up/not securing some of the loans more permanently (either as signings or extended loans next season) and having the "play-off hangover" next season. It happens to a lot of clubs - they miss out in the play-offs and fans assume that that's OK because they'll be challenging again next season and they just have an absolute mare.
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Mexicano Rojo on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 11:00:22 what like millwall?
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: pauld on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 11:02:31 what like millwall? No, more like Carlisle and plenty of other teams both in League One and the Championship. I can't be arsed to go look them all up but it does happen that a surprising number of teams that have challenged strongly the season before seem to take the disappointment into the next season. Hence the term "playoff hangover"Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: sheepshagger on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 11:07:47 I have a prediction that regardless of whether we go up or not through the playoffs - I will have a playoff hangover :D
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Ralphy on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 12:23:57 I'm not looking forward to the play offs one bit.
I may go grey and become an alcoholic. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Arriba on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 13:45:39 to win the play offs is the best way, as it's like a cup final with promotion the prize.
cunt if you lose though. if we win our remaining games then i think we'll get second,which personally i'd prefer, as i dont fancy us in the play offs for some reason. so i can't really answer the poll so wont vote.confused or what? Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: herthab on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 13:48:28 Automatic promotion for me. If we end up in the play-offs I won't be around for the final (Assuming we make it) which would be a major pisser.
(I wouldn't even be able to watch it on the telly, as I'd be on a plane from Cairo to Luxor). Stupid fucking holiday. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: pauld on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 14:37:45 Seems a lot of people are not reading the question. It's not "which would you prefer?" it's "Which would be better for the club?"
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Colin Todd on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 14:40:19 How much money would we get for finishing 2nd?
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: adje on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 14:41:51 Surely you dont make more money via the play-offs than automatic promotion,that would just be wrong!
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Jamiesfuturewife on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 14:43:13 Automatic promotion for me. If we end up in the play-offs I won't be around for the final (Assuming we make it) which would be a major pisser. (I wouldn't even be able to watch it on the telly, as I'd be on a plane from Cairo to Luxor Stupid fucking holiday. wow that's pretty harsh Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: jonny72 on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 14:57:28 How much money would we get for finishing 2nd? Last season it was £10k for finishing 2nd in League One. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: fish head on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 15:14:29 Seems a lot of people are not reading the question. It's not "which would you prefer?" it's "Which would be better for the club?" i would prefer to go up through the play offs! i never made our trips to wembley in the 90's and watching the 93 wembley wizards video makes me jealous! i booked the play off dates off work months ago so at least the holidays wont go to waste. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: pauld on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 15:35:18 Surely you dont make more money via the play-offs than automatic promotion,that would just be wrong! Yes you do, but you're taking the gamble that you won't get promoted. Bit like when Brucey asks if you want to keep what you've won so far or gamble and go for the carTitle: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: nochee on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 15:41:03 I would take the play offs everytime (if we were to win) Great 3 days out, more football to watch and a big ol red army party. Finishing 2nd is good but its just 2nd. In fact winning the POF is probably a better feeling of jubilation than winning the league outright. You cant beat a big red army day out at wembley and seeing your team lift a trophy in front of 40,000 fans.
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Arriba on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 15:42:48 i'm just trying to work out where the mass piss up party will be post wembley?
1993 outside the vic-longs was mental Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: nochee on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 15:44:19 i'm just trying to work out where the mass piss up party will be post wembley? 1993 outside the vic-longs was mental Party and a half that one! Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: adje on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 15:55:52 Yes you do, but you're taking the gamble that you won't get promoted. Bit like when Brucey asks if you want to keep what you've won so far or gamble and go for the car play-offs then Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: THE FLASH on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 16:00:46 Automatic promotion for me. If we end up in the play-offs I won't be around for the final (Assuming we make it) which would be a major pisser. (I wouldn't even be able to watch it on the telly, as I'd be on a plane from Cairo to Luxor). Stupid fucking holiday. Put that in the special 69er edition! It would make me laff!! Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: reeves4england on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 17:08:30 I'm pretty sure a play-off final win would be the best way in terms of finances and publicity, so I voted for that.
I'm hoping for 2nd place though - from a fan's point of view the play-offs are very uncertain, nerve wracking and rather expensive! Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: crystall Tips on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 17:11:20 Auto for me. Nerves already completely shot, would like the team to earn the right via points.
Also, Jimmy Hill once said 'well the Swindon fans had a nice day out' - that was after Wembley and demotion in 1990. So I don't hold with nice days out being alright, they are only good if you win and that's not guaranteed. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: herthab on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 17:58:17 Put that in the special 69er edition! It would make me laff!! What makes it funnier is that the holiday's a present. And I'm supposed to be fucking grateful! Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Iffy's Onion Bhaji on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 17:59:22 Automatic all the way. Let's face it you have a 1 in 4 chance in the play-offs. I still have very bad memories of the last time. I don't care if it's glamourous. It's fucking nail biting and depression when you lose.
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: donkey on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 18:18:45 What makes it funnier is that the holiday's a present. And I'm supposed to be fucking grateful! I've already told the wife that anything I agree to in May is under the strictest of understanding that I can and will drop it based on playoff matches. Auto for me, as it gives us an extra two/three weeks to get players in. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: leefer on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 18:20:50 I've already told the wife that anything I agree to in May is under the strictest of understanding that I can and will drop it based on playoff matches. Auto for me, as it gives us an extra two/three weeks to get players in. And out. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Spy on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 18:24:10 OK it seems like at least half of the people in this thread didn't grasp the fact the idea was not to choose between playoffs and automatic promotion but between a playoff final win and automatic promotion.
:blowup: Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Mexicano Rojo on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 18:25:28 depends if win the play offs or not
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Iffy's Onion Bhaji on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 18:26:09 OK it seems like at least half of the people in this thread didn't grasp the fact the idea was not to choose between playoffs and automatic promotion but between a playoff final win and automatic promotion. :blowup: I'd still take automatic. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: donkey on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 18:28:44 depends if win the play offs or not :D Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Batch on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 19:50:11 OK it seems like at least half of the people in this thread didn't grasp the fact the idea was not to choose between playoffs and automatic promotion but between a playoff final win and automatic promotion. But that is silly. Of course a playoff final win is better than second place. If only it was that easy. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: OOH! SHAUN TAYLOR on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 19:55:02 But that is silly. Of course a playoff final win is better than second place. If only it was that easy. Not necessarily. I would say it is more of an achievement to finish second in this division of 'big teams' than to go up via the play offs. For that reason, I would actually take automatic. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Doore on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 19:58:37 Not necessarily. I would say it is more of an achievement to finish second in this division of 'big teams' than to go up via the play offs. For that reason, I would actually take automatic. Second is more of a long-term achievement and you can look back on a whole season of success. The play-offs offer a more instant "glory day" feeling where you end up remembering a couple of special days. Of course, I'd be bloody delighted with either. How times have changed that we can actually have this amusing debate. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Batch on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 20:09:51 Not necessarily. I would say it is more of an achievement to finish second in this division of 'big teams' than to go up via the play offs. For that reason, I would actually take automatic. But Spy asked which would be better for the club, not which is the better achievement. The press, the extra £££ and the chance to take some potential new fans to Wembley outweigh anything else. Personally I'd settle for second :) Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Spencer_White on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 20:19:57 Automatic.
We need a new challenge. Weve had too much apathy and not enough enthusiasm from the fans for the past couple of seasons. Hopefully new grounds, new clubs, bigger clubs would get the fans going a bit again. Play offs give you a no better chance than 1 in 4. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: OOH! SHAUN TAYLOR on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 20:41:40 Play offs give you a no better chance than 1 in 4. You're not paying attention Spencer..you'll make Spy spontaneously combust again 8)Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Spencer_White on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 20:53:39 You're not paying attention Spencer..you'll make Spy spontaneously combust again 8) I know. But there really is no comparison to be made! Brighton were the shittest team out of the 4 in 2004. Sorry to undermine your poll! Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Simon Pieman on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 20:59:10 Bit of a silly question really. If we were certain we would win the playoffs it would bring more money, television/media exposure and potentially additional future fans.
Where's the option for not getting promoted though? Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Oaksey Moonraker on Wednesday, April 21, 2010, 22:24:08 Just been checking the odds on promotion on Betfair and there are some people putting some big money being laid and backed on Millwal and Charlton. We've moved into 2-1 as well.
Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Spy on Thursday, April 22, 2010, 14:07:15 Where's the option for not getting promoted though? It's not an option. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Talk Talk on Thursday, April 22, 2010, 19:39:42 It's not an option. Where's the option for Spy's first coronary? Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: Rich Pullen on Thursday, April 22, 2010, 20:24:20 I'd take automatic promotion over the Play-Offs.
To be honest, I'm a fan of the Play-Offs. Since the 80's, everybody has understood at the start of the season that if you finish below second (or third in L2) then you have to go into them. Automatic over so many "superior" teams in this division would be amazing. Plus the stadia difference between L1 and Championship would feel like a 'big day out' for a good long while! We've only been out of the 2nd tier for a decade but football is so much different it'll feel like the top flight. Title: Re: Promotion - Playoffs or Automatic? Post by: OOH! SHAUN TAYLOR on Thursday, April 22, 2010, 21:06:04 We've only been out of the 2nd tier for a decade but football is so much different it'll feel like the top flight. Only a decade?? That's a hell of a long time in my book. It will be great to get back up there though and it will/would indeed be a big step up. |