Thetownend.com

...ok so I was at a loss to what to call this thread...but...anyway I remember a couple of seasons back when under the guidence of Paul Sturrock we stuck 5 goals without reply against a a awful, lackluster, passionless Gillingham team.

Paul Scally as a gesture of goodwill refunded the travelling fans their ticket money.

I think it would be a fantastic idea if our club did the same. Paying the best part of £20 to watch your team get beat 5-0 is a disgrace naturally, let alone with the financial climate the way it is and thats just the price of the match that doesnt even bring travel into it!

On behalf of the team apologise to us.

Pay your money, takes your choice.

All teams have very good days and very bad days. If we had won 5-0 should fans pay more after the game?

I agree with this actually. We've seen some decent gestures by the board in the time they've been here and one like this wouldn't go amiss. Fitton was at the game today. I'm sure he's just as depressed and pissed off as the other 788 that travelled.

Didn't the gills have something like only 14* supporters that day though.

they can take the money out of the striker kitty if they have to!

i'd like to now why fitton and co bought stfc.i have asked this question from day 1.

To make a profit on the money they have invested? It's called business. 

Me too....I want to know why hardly any money from Cox's sale has been put back into the team apart from £100,000 on Cuthbert.

Fitton is tight in my opinion, Always thought that and he is proving me right, Get some more players in asap!

Did he buy STFC because of the new stadium thing? Because he isn't putting much money into the team and that is a big concern.

Did they just want a football club? It's lots of people's dream. They certainly don't seem to have the delusion of quick profit, or indeed any profit.

On today's result, it's a nice cop out to go the "first game doesn't matter" or "the board off the pitch good blah blah blah" or whatever else excuse, but really it was a fucking unqualified disaster and there needs to be some apologies and meaningful gestures.

There's no getting out of losing 5-0 away to one of the lesser teams in the league on your opening day.

Yeah if i'd put 10 million to clear the debt of a company i'd be a bit tight with my money as well.

Apart from buying Cox, McNamee and Cuthbert who have this board paid for, no one - thats who!

How long before Bart puts in an appearance

There are words for people like you.

I couldn't give a toss what you say to be honest, That's my opinion, Like it or lump it, The board need to sort the fucking mess out, get some bloody strikers in and give DW a bit more money, Unless you want another season like last season?

Didn't we pay for those youth players from Plymouth as well?

I do agree there seems to be a problem with Fitton not being willing to pay that little bit extra to get his man.

are you serious? clubs like ours dont make money.it is fucking stupid buying stfc if you want to make money out of it



ben,i fully agree with your response to my question.

You're spot on with that one.

Jesus fucking Christ.

I know this is the TEF and all that but fuck off.

I dont give a shit what you think of the board, their invest and our strikers. For all you know the money could be there but Wilson not spending it. Perhaps no players wants to bloody come here and play infront of ingrateful people like you? Maybe the money has gone toward paying off our debts so we dont go into admin and then bust?

Anyway, this post was supposed to be a serious post about our board apologising to the fans for the on pitch disaster that was todays. Other clubs have done it in the past and I think its a good idea.

If you want to bicker about the boards intentions then go do it else where like thisis.

How did you know i wasn't thinking of a nice word?

Fucking hell :D

What about Reading, look at them as a club that was our size when they were at Elm park (in fact probably smaller).

If Madjeski had sold them when they were in the Premier League, I'm sure he would have made a tidy profit.

The thing is that the board have to make us a successful club, if they wan't to make any profit from a future sale. However, unless they invest in the team it's not gonna happen.

With regards to the Original Post, have to say I'm having second thoughts about going to the Dongs on Tuesday, maybe they will let us in Free :D

it will take a complete restucure of our youth set up,and fitton to put some proper invesment into the team to mirror what readin have done.
i'd love us to do a similar thing but cannot se it currently.

 The board have been consistent in saying they'll not throw money at this project, and have been true to their word. 

 We've got stability off the pitch and mediocrity on the pitch....it's a bugger, but that's how it is.

It also took Reading 10 years to get it right even with the cash.

Swansea are a better example for me. If they can do it so cann
 we.

can we please not get too carried away, at the end of the day its 1 defeat, i know its a very poor defeat but its still only 1 game. It was only a few days ago we was all talking up how good Morrison/Greer/McNamee/Douglas are, that doesnt change after 1 poor performance. I want strikers in as much as the next person but at least we know that Wilson is not signing players who he isnt 100% sure on, at least we know when we sign strikers they will be very good players.

 
Being Welsh means you can get shit loads of funding from England for new stadia etc.

Just been reading some Gills comments, they say that all their players were on top form.....maybe it was just the WRONG time to be playing them. I still think we need to see what we do in the next 5 or 6 games to be able to judge.

AS I've tried to point out before Wilson's record on buying strikers is at best patchy at worst embarrassing...however you want to look at it, going into the season with only one striker is incompetent.

We're now under pressure, which increases the likelihood of taking someone like Trundle on loan.

Mediocrity is not the word Reg-we're far worse than that

  :(

And decreases the very slight odds of someone half decent coming here.

Going back to DV's original point, some kind of statement other than Wilson coming out and saying "I don't know what went wrong" would be nice. I'm not after a refund for my ticket or anything like that, it would just be nice to see the board, management and players accept responsibility for what was a shambolic performance. The players have totally lost the faith of the fan base in the space of just 90 minutes, and it's going to take more than Gordon Greer's "It's up to us" statement to earn it back.

JPC

I completely agree with you bar a few points, which are biggies for me ;

I really dont mind dishing out money to travel the county watching my club, through good times and also bad. That's what we do as football fans FFS !

What I wont sit back and put up with after spending good money that I dont really have is ;

a) A line up that has not even been tried in any form of game apart from maybe a training pitch exercise

b) A lackluster display from a so called team of professionals that are supposedly "playing for the shirt", who quite clearly did not have the inclination or motivation to up their work rate or desire to win the game, yet alone compete.

c) The complete apathy and non- committal to acknowledge the dissenting voice of the paying customers from both player AND managerial staff alike.

If this is the model that Mr Fitton wants to adopt in order to make this a viable "business interest" then I am extremely sad to say that after over 30 years of support, mine will be withdrawn

I think that is the opinion of many others, well said.

I totally agree with the idea of refunds ...

absolutely no chance of this happening ... money is too tight!

I think a lot of these opinions have arisen from a case of raised expectations and this kinda belief we acquire when we start receiving something and want more.

We now have an open board who communicate and want to move the club in the right direction. I think this has forced us to want more and now. I mean we haven't been treated this well for years, and we've put up with immeasurably worse times, so why do people seem to demand more now? I think it's like a smack addict, we've had a bit, we want more, then we want it always and eventually anything less than always is unimaginable.

With regard to a refund, this is just compensation culture going wrong. I'm angry and am fucked off I went, but it was my choice and it's my cross to bare. If they offered me a refund I'd feel embarrassed to take it, because it's all part of the price we pay, emotionally and financially, to support our team. In many ways it's similar to gambling. We're gambling on paying to see a good match, sometimes they don't come in, but we're not entitled to a refund.

No expectations on my part, optimism yes ! based on a steady pre-season Barry

What tears me apart, is why have a pre-season if you are not going to carry forward what you have learned to the first game.

Betfair would have probably offered 600's on today's starting line up after what we produced in the friendlies

Oh yeah, don't get me wrong Fred. I also had great expectations for today. We've looked tidy in pre-season and cuthbert starting was certainly a strange one.

Talking of Betfair, i'll probably get better than 70-1 now for champs, so i'll have to put some more down. :D

It'll all be forgotten if we win during the week,its a bit embarrassing and that but losing isnt really the end of the world.Fitton and Wilson cant suddenly go from being the Bees Knees to total Gash on the strength of one result.

Thanks Yeovil. :)

I avoid the forum between games if we lose, as I hate getting sucked into and influenced in all this. Shit happens, we're still going up.

Shit does happen, i think its the kick up the arse we needed!
Last season we won our first game and then went on a shite run of form right up to october! Id rather take this defeat on the chin and hopefully have a better run of form over the next couple of months! Then we can start to worry if its still all tits up! Its one game...fucking loads left to go!

I really admire some of the optimism on show after a 5-0 defeat, but surely Fitton has to learn some lessons from this.

I'll be ever thankful for the club saving antics that him and his mates pulled off, and if it's a choice between them and the other offers which were apperently about (possibly even incuding power/trust) then I'm happy it's Fitton and co.

But he hasn't learnt a fucking thing. Two slow manager appointments later and he still seems to be making the same mistakes when it comes to replacing a striker. I understand and accept the buying on our own terms thing, but you can't rebuild a football club without sorting shit out on the pitch, however fucking brilliant the catering and newly painted clubshop are.

Don't get me wrong. I'm happy to linger about in league one indefinitely, I see it as our natural league position. But if you're going to make promises of 3 years until championship (extended to five I believe) then you've got to make some effort to push forward on it.

Saying that, the poaching of some youth players from Plymouth earlier in the summer makes it clear that he's making an effort on one part of the plan, but I think he has to realise that you can't make a financial profit on every spend. Maybe sometimes you need to buy a player who's value is only going down whatever (due to age probably), just to get a return on the pitch.

end of rant.

Is Fitton to blame for the striker shortage? I'd be very surprised if he hasn't made at least a few hundred grand available for a replacement for Cox which is more than enough at this level, so can he be blamed?

I honestly think the problem is that they had a number of strikers lined up and every single one fell through. They didn't give any thought to this scenario so didn't have a safety net leaving us in the position we are now in.

If this is what happened, I'd blame Wilson. He is the experienced manager and he shouldn't have let it happen.

Fitton & co have always put their hands in their pockets when they've needed to and there is absolutely nothing to suggest they have suddenly become tight as fuck - they just don't want to piss their money away which is fair enough.

There's too much history of signings and managers falling through now that it can't be a coincidence.

Personally I don't think it's either of the extremes (which to be honest I thought I made clear in the post before), I think it's quite clear that Fitton is willing to spend money. He has done on several occasions.

I don't think it's that he's tight, but it seems like he's only interested in players which can be seen as investments. Spending on players isn't always about the financial return when you sell them on later, the football return is just as important.

Spending money on the team is not necessarily the answer to our problems.  Norwich spent heavily this summer including 1/2 a million on Grant Holt, and they got completely stuffed at home by Colchester.  

I think calling Fitton tight is a bit unfair considering how much money he has invested in town so far.  Also he did back Wilson when attempting to sign Robinson (275k) and OTJ (250k) before the Cox deal was complete.

Losing on the first day of the new season is bad enough but to lose so heavily to a supposed rival is even worse.  We do need strikers in and soon but I think the players Wilson has been trying to sign would have been good for the next few years of STFC and not just in the short term.  Trying to sign these players may see us miss out on more than we get but it's got to be in the best interests of STFC to be looking at players who have either played at a higher level or show the potential to make the step up.

Let's at least try to be a little bit more patient and see what pans out over the next month before we all call for Wilson and Fitton to be lynched.

I agree with everything you've said to a point. But starting the season with one striker is incompetent, and not good in the long term however you spin it.

I agree that a large part of the problem is that Fitton is still learning and that his inexperience has played a major role in the striker fiasco. But Wilson doesn't have any excuse and shouldn't have let it happen, and I can't believe that Fitton wouldn't have listened if Wilson had pushed him on it.

I reckon Fitton sees all players as investments, but I'm not sure they all have to return a profit. Look at Greer, Lucas and Douglas, none of whom are likely to return a profit - sure they were all freebies but I'd imagine they're amongst the highest paid players at the club now.

Out of interest was it ever stated how long Douglas had signed for?

Then one of them is to blame, which is it?

Its difficult to say without knowing all the facts. But I'd say Wilson as with all his years experience in football he should have seen the possibility of this happening and ensuring that it didn't. I'm sure Fitton would have yielded to him as any good businessman would listen to those more knowledgeable than them.

This is all getting blown out of proportion though, its one game. Looking at the goals on the BBC highlights it appears the main issue was the same as happened in a lot of games last season - the entire team went in to "shit mode". They're just as likely to go in to "not bad mode" on Tuesday and stuff Southampton.

It was no suprise that Cox was going to leave this summer, we all expected it at the start of last season. Surely enough time to look for strikers??

I agree with Ben, it's simply incompetence. If Paynter was injured pre-season what then? We don't even have a couple of kids coming through as strikers.

ben is spot on, and is raising the right questions.
we have missed out on loads of potential players and managers,have been hammered first game of the season with players looking like sluggish sunday league fatties,and others out of position.

I'm not sure having an extra striker would have saved us yesterday, and as pointed out, Norwich showed just how well spending cash can work for you in a one off game.

All very odd.

On Fitton, the strategy is clear, spend on potential youth talent, do not spend on players of a certain age who are here to do a job.  If we weren't happy with it, we should have moaned while he was buying the club so the old regime could hang on a bit longer and see if someone else came in or we got to start over in the non league arena.

It's going to take something huge for them to change tack, maybe 1 whole season of struggle at the foot of the table and crowds below season ticket sales?  I doubt mid table drudgery will force a change in policy.

As for why did they buy the club, I'd guess that it may have been something to do with a local club facing liquidation and being available for a relatively affordable purchase price may have had something to do with why a business man and his friends shelled out when they had been trying to buy a football club for years purchased us.  I don't think they have some grand scheme about making money, West Ham are proving how that doesn't even work at the top table, and clearly knew the ground development buffet had proved to be a cold finger one at best.  They just happen to be able to afford to buy a football club and wanted to have a better toy than FM2009 or the Hornby train set, plus an idea that they could make it work.  Time will tell.

Heres hoping its not just for sheer amusement factor as we are already a laughing stock.

Si Pie, are you in any way responsible for somebody being positive on 606?

I don't think it was, but I do think it's a sort of "wouldn't it be good to own a football club and see if we can run it well" type of thing.  Hence, why he tried to get Newcastle years ago, it's clearly an ambition (one a few of us woul probably share with enough cash in the bank).  The fact they have well off friends who can back them is good for us, it means it's on old style ownership just with a bit of extra capital to support the idea.  It's why huge sums won't be splashed, they could have purchased a good team if that was the case.

His stance on players agents although honourable stops us getting the targets we want and need.

His stance is no different to others look at last seasons list of who paid what to agents.

Not at all, what did it say?

A text from Simon in Swindon, saying that while the result was shit, we needed to thank Fitton and Wilson for a long list of stuff off the field, but finished saying that at the end of the day we need to move forwards on the field.

Oh right, I thought you meant the 606 forum. I don't listen to the 606 show, yesterday I was busy having a few beers in old town with female company, I've just been to Lydiard Park for a wander round so nowhere near a radio.