Thetownend.com

Just posted this on THAT other forum !!

Thought it deserves a wider [more discerning ??] audience !!


Listening to Dennis on the radio tonight, seems he's very keen to sign Brez, and actually said the fee to sign him under the option 'ain't very much' !!

I'm an ex member of the Trust, but do still contribute to the Red Army fund each month [ok, only a fiver !] - but I can't think of anything that would be better to do with the fund, than help secure Brez as a permanent member of STFC.

I don't know how much the fee is, or how much is in the fund, but don't you agree - it would certainly help, and would be a great achievement if we could pull it off.

It would be a great investment, as Brez will either go on to be a Town legend for years to come, or will get sold off at a nice profit to a higher league club.

Also, and not least - it might get the Trust some much-needed good publicity, and help to heal over some of the open wounds at the moment !!

PS - just imagine if 2,000 fans gave just a fiver a month to the Red Army fund - that would be......????...... around £120,000 a year for Dennis and Gus to spend - just imagine the difference that would make at this level !!  
 

Good post ...

IIRC, the first option was set at £100,000. Could the RAF really raise this amount of money by the end of the season?

FWIW, Paul Wardell (RAF coordinator) has approached the club to indicate there are funds currently available should the club need them to get in a keeper on loan while Brez is out injured.

Whether raising £100k by the end of the season is feasible is another thing - there's also the question of how well he'll recover from his injury. Some players never get over an injury like that. That said, assuming he does come back the same player, I'm sure we'd love to be in a position to help pay for him!

How about the club fund it?

How about they're fucking broke....

Do you have this club confused with Chelsea or something?

 :wanker:

I know the Brez situation is a bad one, but I can't help but smirk a little at the irony of the club using the RAF fund after the past few weeks.  Maybe it might serve as a little reminder about the hard work fans of this club do put it (as the RAF is a result of people giving their time and even more people giving their money) and the fact that fans just want their club to be secure.

Broke?

Do you know where all the money has gone/is going then northern.

I thought not

Do you?

I doubt it too.

If the answer is yes, why not enlighten us oh wise one. Otherwise shut it.

No i dont, but i want to as do many other supporters

a bit harsh on bart i think.its miss management of the books by the board on better than expected gates that has led to this seasons money balls ups.there should have been plenty to fund a keeper

Nothing to know really Barty Boo. Club operates at a loss, generates no profit, money pays for servicing debts, players wages etc. We don't have the luxury of having huge profit margins, in fact i think you'll find our debt probably increases each year.

I'm assumming that you think Diamandis is pulling millions out of the club each month to pay for girls and crack?

Seriously Barty...

I  think you'll find it's young boys and crack.

Did anyone see on t'Official Site that Dennis and Gus had payed for Brez's mum to come over to England? Top notch I thought and shows how much they think of him.

maybe she's fit and dennis and gus thought it may help their chances of some action if they paid for her trip?? :piemonte:

fair play to dennis and gus, they actually seem teh only people at this club with a bit upstairs and know how to respect and look after people.  Others should take note

Not really. The guy keep suggesting he knows more of what's going on behind the scenes than the rest of us but when challenged seems to know jack. He's getting on my man breasts.

just thought he was asking a question.admittedly he has spouted bollocks in the past

He said:



Insinuation: He knows where it has gone and has knocked Northern Red for his 'lack of knowledge'

We'll see what the price is....Dennis said it was cheap, if it is I'll buy him  8)

Seriously though, has the fixed amount been included in the budget....or has it been counted in the overspend...or has it not been accounted for.

This needs to be asked to at the AGM....for all we know the Brez transfer money could already be put to one side...

If we sign him, we'll flog him within week for profit anyway

if we dont snap him up,someone else will.
we should tie him down on a 3 year deal if we can.
he's the best keeper we've had since digby.

That reads like a poem.

How about we raise a private consortium, purchase the player for the club and divvy the shares at say £100 each?

On the basis the player signs for say 3 years after 1.5years the consortium has control of the transfer status and the option to sell the player with each share providing a return to shareholders.

great idea,count me in!

maybe we could organise a charity fight night, tag teams for the undisputed miserable bastard world title ...  Arriba/Spacey  Vs Mexico/STFC Bart . Flammable could run the bar ,Sadie/Birdy could hold the round boards , and Sonic could fuck up the scoreboard .

:Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

I wouldn't trust Ben running a bar...

if it is "cheap" as Wise says then continued good gates should mean we can afford him. what about the Sean O'Hanlon money as well?

Not really, the "overspend" was £750k taking account of the increased gates (working on about 7500 gates I think).

A la Tevez/Maschereno?!?  Great idea Dazzza, I'd be up for that we could get a hell of a return on "our" investment.  As long as the dopey bastard doesn't keep breking his arms.

  The official debt  , albeit not written off by the auditors, is given  as 14,667,309 pounds in the recent accounts up to 2 years ago.

  That's a lot of money spent in reaching the basement of English pro football, a semi competent Board could have done it much more cheaply.

FWIW, Reg, I think a fair chunk of that has now been "restructured" - ie converted into long-term loans and hence taken off the balance sheet.

 Well its on my balance sheet......can I just rub it out or put a line through it then, I believe its what they do in the New Zealand school of accounting.

I thought a lot of it would have been written off via the CVA but I guess we'll find out when the accounts are probably finalised in 3 years time.

Not picking holes or nothing but if it's a long term loan, it would still be on the balance sheet as it would represent an obligation to pay. But like Reg said, it wouldn't surprise me if it's been crossed off just because someone believes it can be!

*takes deep breath*

Firstly I've not a clue where the money has gone, all I said was we're broke. 14,667,309 pounds down according to Reg/Accounts, so I'd say I was about right. We also seem to be losing money at the rate of 700/750k per season, frequently bailed out by the Wills. Thus we're hardly in the position to be buying players. Some suggestions of "buy him" and "lets build a new ground" imply we've got money, when the facts are there. We're a financial crisis with no assets, and are not in the position to spend what little money we have willy-nilly. The board would love to buy Brez, Wisey would love to buy Brez, and the fans wouyld love Brez to be bought. But the money is simply not there.... unless you raid the RAF, bucket collect and trim bits off in various places and look under the sofa. It may happen, but its needs finances to be raised in appropriate, not by smashing open this mythical piggybank that everyone seems to think the club is hiding somewhere.

And Bart :wanker:

Well said

but the money should be there.thats what stinks.we have decent gates exceding expectation but piss poor book keeping!

It should, but a legacy of bad debts and repayments, means that any money made now goes straight towards paying CVA's and paying off old bills. There's nothing leftover and we're still losing money at the rate of 700k per season.

In about 10 years when we've repayed £15 million in debts we'll start buying players again.

shut up its depressing me.

In the 2001/2002 and 2002/2003 season we had a turnover of £2.9m (approx).
This rose to £4m in the following season following a good season. Total wages in all of those season were in the region of £2.7-2.9m.

Basically we don't make much (if any) once wages are paid out, then you have your other expenses. It's a cunt.

do we have any assets on the balance sheet?

About £1.5m or so when the last accounts were filed. Unfortunately we had £11.35m in liabilities (all approx)

what assets have we got? The club's a state

Buildings, plant and vehicles and intangibles (players I would guess).

The debt Reg refers to is the retained loss in the accounts.

intangibles will be goodwill. Thought we sold all our vehicles (including the youth team minibus) years ago. What buildings do we own?

Guessing the stands?

Didn't think about goodwill. But why would we have that?

all companies have that. Not sure what our Goodwill will be worth these days with all the Board shenanighans going on

Aye sorry I wasn't clear. It went up in the last set of accounts. We couldn't just capitalise goodwill that wasnt there surely? Damn these silly summarised accounts

doubt it. Those accounts are ridiculous anyway. If an investor wanted to put any money in, how would they know what the club was worth? The accounts are years out of date. Any other company would have been wound up long ago

It is likely to be for player registrations. I thought I remembered it, that's what football teams do, capitalise it as an intangible then amortise.

http://www.football-research.org/fitda/FITDA-chapter20.htm

oh dear. More familiar with FRS27 myself, but this basically means the club has no assets at all

But how are we still losing £700k per year?

Our wage bill aint a fortune, it does not add up. Until i see transparancy i refuse to believe anything that comes out from the club including the financials

Let's try some maths then ...

Player wage bill ... Let's say £200,000pa

Staff costs: 25 staff on average of £30,000 is £750,000pa

That's nearly a million already in running costs

Rent is around £250,000pa

£1.25m now to run the club.

Then there's things like electricity bills, water bills ... Reckon on maybe a conservative estimate of £150,000pa

Let's say £1.5m per year JUST to run the club.

On an average gate of 5,000pa at costs of £20 a ticket matchday income over a season is £2,000,000 ... But there are plenty of tickets that cost less (£10 town end, season tickets, concessions) ... so let's say £1.5m matchday income.

And ... bloody hell. I've already found a shortfall.

Granted I've not included merchandise sales ...

But even with my shit pigeon maths I've found a hole.

Brown nose

Its amazing what you can come up with with some educated guesses. Likewise its not difficult to guess how the club "could" turn a profit.

Lets not forget sponsorship deals, TV revenue (if there was any?), and revenue from Dinner evenings, and any monies received based on final league position etc.

Yep, I know. It's just pigeon maths and without knowing the full facts you just don't know.

I know you've pointed out other incomes, but other outgoings include the CVA payments and other loans which must be causing more drag on finances. You can see why we're losing cash.

:wanker:

Well said  :D

This club will just amble on with no goals, no direction and objectives with these clowns running it

Change the fucking record you cunt.

its no good us doing the maths as we dont know the facts.
all we can guarantee is that the club has been mis-managed for years and it will take years to get out of it,if at all.
one minuite we are told that things are looking up then bang,it all goes tits up again.
fucking depressing!

Tell me then what are our objectives- plans to go forward.

There aint any

STFC's objective is financial survival, we can't move forward until then...

Yes and if we still  had Bill Power- remember our only investor in 5 years- and Dimandis hadnt pissed him off we may have that assured already.

Tell me then- what are the boards objectives to deliver financial security- guess they havent got any

No, but they kept us from going bust four years back.

And, you *still* do not have any proof that Diamandis what the cause of Bill Power leaving.

The only concrete, hard evidence we've had is that he left through ill health.

I hope you realise every single time you say what you're saying about Diamandis you are actually sladering him ... Unless you actually want to offer up some proof here.

I'd also point out that even if Bill Power was on-board it wouldn't mean, from a business point of view, that we were stable. Power would have been plugging a financial hole - nothing more, nothing less. As a business we'd still have been losing money.

The only way out is a new ground to maximise on non-match day activities and the only people holding that back are the council.

Fuck you Bart, how do you know Diamandis pissed him off? You're a mindless delusional cunt who thinks we should be pushing for the premiership.

Think Bart. No one is pulling money out of the club, why would they? Where would they get it?

The fact is we have a fuck load of debt, to survive is an achievement.

The boards objective is to ensure we survive, to allow us to amble along servicing our considerable debt until such time as we can aim higher.

Power's money would have done little, any injections of cash are short lived as they would fall into the black hole of our debt. His money would have allowed some small financial luxuries, but in the long term would have just kept us on a false even keel until the debt collectors come banging.

I think you should have a long hard think about our club, it's finances and it's directors. I think it's stupid to assume people are milking the club, we are no West Ham and SSW is no Terrence Brown. We are far from a cash producing equity rich company. We are a stuggling debt ridden pauper of a club. End of.

Reduce costs and increase profits same as any company. Made a start by cutting Linda and Incey but to increase profits apart from selling assets football clubs rely on investors or THE FANS

cannot blame the council for no new ground,its the clubs fault.
and i'd question powers health being the reason he's left.certainly not concrete.

barry scott,you are spot on!

Well said, Baz.

The fact is most of our historic debt has come from trying to get back to the Premiership during the 90s.

Nobody 'took' cash ... we just spent too much. Simple fact.

Meanwhile your spelling is slanderous.  :mrgreen:

Didn't say Power was concrete, I said the only concrete proof we had was the official club statement.

Until we know otherwise all we're doing is speculating and pissing in the wind.

We might as well take them at face value until we know otherwise.

Hahaha ... I'm a journalist, not a sub editor. They're the ones who get money to spell.

And the new townend.com slogan is born

you didn't but never mind.i see your point now

Think I did ...

The truth will come out chaps

I'll give you credit, you are an excellent wind up merchant

and a cunt

I don't think that people are taking money out the club like that but I do have some points:



The club has said serveral attempts to contact Power by Diamandis were ignored. I think this was beofre the crash, wehich leads to questions and speculaton about why the calls weren't returned. It wasn't necessarly Diamandis that he fell out with. On the other hand it may have been unrelated to any fall out. We will have to hope for the other sides point of view, if it ever comes at all.

But if this was after the crash it is understandable.


I think that people see that the club is effect being run by Mr Diamandis. He is in charge of Dunwoody. Dunwoody have contracts to supply STFC.

All of the above point may be totally irrelevant, but the conflict of interest and lack of transparency will always make some people suspicious.


Totally agree there. But the board seem to be running our of cash, or rather Sir Seaton Wills does. We need to somehow become self sufficient ASAP. I guess that comes down to the ground redevelopment


I think that is probably true, but the club may well have at least afforded a good team short term. Which is what a large % of fans want.  Who knows what contacts Power may or may not have head elsewhere to help move us forward?

As i said, thr truth will come out.

Remember we have only heard from the club. Nothing official from Power,Devlin or Linda.

And to be honest- how can you believe anything the club say when :

1) 1 week there wasnt a rift- the next they release a statement to say there was

2) 1 day they agree to work with the fans- 3 days later they totally contradict themselves

That I can 100% agree with ... and I would like to know what kind of behind-the-scenes involvement the man *really* has.

Chris read back to the club statements- James Wills said he signs off all decisions.

No, that is true. But the point I keep making to you is that until we do hear we're all thinking the worst.

My issue with you is summed up in the first line there. "As I said ..."

You're making out you know more than you're saying on this forum. I'll say it again ... put up, or shut up. Either admit you know jack and you're just speculating or tell what you know.

I suspect the jack option myself.

What's that got to do with the price of fish?

Now who's acting stupid?

Bart is perfectly clear. He means the club should be pushing for the premiership and diamandis is milking this club for every penny. Why are we letting it happen?   :wink:

Great post  :clap:

I feel such a dumb schumck now for not spotting that.  :oops:

Shamed.

The one issue with Diamandis, and it doesn't matter whether he is a saint or a sinner, is the fact that he has final say on the major decisions at the football club but does not have the accountability of a Director or employee.

Whether the club like it or not, that does create a perception problem at the very least.

Imagine if some bloke was actually telling Blair what to do, and they publicly let us know that it was case.  I'd imagine a National outcry via the media would begin, about slease etc.

Now, that's not to say he does anything wrong at all, it's just a question of someone having a lot of responsibility without the accountability.

True, but surely he is accountable to SSW?

Anyway, i see what you say. It remind me of that dickhead who was helping that Blair arsehole, Alistair Campbell.

It's because it's not a legal accountability.  As a shareholder you can not hold his decisions to account, and there is the big problem which is impossible to get around regardless of the actual job he does.

It allows people to question Dunwoody contracts for example, even if Dunwoody provided the best quote.

Which also isn't concrete proof of anything, fwiw. No-one's ever disputed BP is still very unwell - the point at issue is/was more whether that was the sole or main reason for him pulling out.

i feel another statement coming if this conversation carries on..

sonic for the future of this club please lock the thread :D

I've missed the lack of statements in the last week.  :cry:

Makes midweek so much more interesting when your football club starts to implode

Yeah, fair point Paul. But with a lack of any statement from Bill then we can only take what the club says at face value.

Saying Bill went because he's pissed off with Diamandis or the state of the bogs or the fact he can't get Babysham in the Winners or whatever is speculation until we know better.

The trouble is people like Bart are taking the "Bill left because he's pissed off with x,y or z" as the truth when we simply don't know that.

Well, as you say, without a statement from Bill there's no "concrete" evidence of anything much either way. And I understand your misgivings over Bart's rather sweeping statements. But there is a plausible reconstruction of events, even from the club's own statements. And now I'm not saying any more unless I attract another fatwa - I said what I had to say at the fans' forum (sourced directly from those involved), the minutes of which are on the Trust website.

You don't want that. They'll be after me next.

I'm blaming you for everything!

isnt this a topic about Brezovan???

Oh right this is actually just another 'i'm right, your wrong and I know more than all of you' conversation ......BORING!!   floghorse

So then ,do you think that the Trust should help buy Brezovan ?  I am more than willing to organise my big fight night .

I dont know how the Trust really works, but as long as the people that put the money into the Trust did or do so knowing who it is that ultimately makes the decisions over who we do and dont help pay for then yes definately!

I'd give all the money required to the Club for Brez if I had it as I think he will not only be a great Keeper for us were we to go up but in the Championship as well and were we not to get promotion in the next few years, he'd definately make a tidy profit for the club by way of sell on price we'd get for him.....
He's definately one of the best outside the Premiership in my opinion and will only get better as he's still a spring chicken age wise for a keeper!

I'm not saying this to get into an argument and I genuinley hope the fella makes a full recovery, but until he does it wouldn't make sense for anyone to splash the cash.
 When he's fully fit and back to his best, and if the club can't afford him, then if the Trust has got the readies, I say go for it! We've still got first option on him after this season, so what's the rush?

The rush is the money needs to be in place when we reach the end of the season. It may be peanuts in the football world, but it is still a lot of money and so the sooner we start the better.

Don't think anyone is suggesting we sign him up before he has at least had a medical even if was just a formality that he makes a full recovery. I'm guessing that is true for insurance purposes too.

Could the trust roll out a kind of, "give us more money, we need brezovan campaign"?

I knwo alot of people know about the trust and i pay into it, but i mean harassing people, cornering people, getting in people faces and saying "look, give me your money or we may lose brez".

I forgot where i saw it, probably on that thisis bag of shit forum, but someone on there had done figures for amount it would cost people to buy brez.

Could we start a company, pay for him through the company, then issue shares in Brezovan in reflection of donations made?

Come on trust dudes, you know your shit. I hope...  :wink:

FWIW, I'd say Batch is right  - it would have to work on the understanding that the RAF money would be used to buy Brez if and only if he passed medicals, Dennis was happy he was back to his best etc.

And Sissy, the money given to the Red Army Fund is not given to the Trust per se - although we administer the Fund, all money given to the RAF is explicitly ring-fenced for being used only to improve the playing squad. So, hope that answers any concern you may have had.

and they had an article in todays Adver promoting the  RAF as a way of paying to buy Brez.

bart you're talking big piles of shite again.

I could be wrong, but I think the reason the club doesnt make a profit year after year is thw £14million pounds worth of debt.

Unless of course you know for a fact we have make £25million a year, then I would be worried!

You mock Bart at your peril.

DV you are being seriously conned

Read Reg Smeetons post on here- here is spot on

The figures do not add up- all this board have brought us is more debt and 2 relegations. face facts

We do pay lots of money out in financing if you look at the cash flows. Not saying nobody is wrong but I don't think you can deny that.

However we haven't been run well we all know that. The accounts are shite and  I'm surprised we haven't been wound up. If we weren't a football club and another business we wouldn't exist.

Our wage bill is only just covered by our income unfortunately Bart. But worringly we are still losing money and profit.

We exist because of the 2nd company which has an agreement until 2008 to fund any losses (I think it states that in the accounts).  So basically our shitness is underwritten until 2008 by SSW and St Modwen.

On the debt subject, didn't Diamandis release a statement to say we now had a positive balance sheet (although he meant this year, not 2004)?

he did. Not really sure how that is possible though :?

well, given that our accounts didn't get the auditors seal of approval, I suppose they can just rub the numbers out when they want....that or someone paid a chunk off and we've completely managed to shove a load of it somewhere else.

The only way it could be positive that I can think off is if the Wills have written off their debt

As I understand it, the debt owed to the Wills family has been restructured into a long-term loan note which takes it off the day-to-day balance sheet (presumably it still gets mentioned in the published accounts but more by way of a footnote). So it's really shuffling money around, although to be fair it does have a real impact (apparently, so I'm told by those who understand these things) in that it makes the business a more attractive prospect for investors. So Rob's "we've completely managed to shove a load of it somewhere else" is a pretty good summary really.

Erm, this is no way forms a statement, of any form, critical or otherwise. Homeowners who secure loans against their property should be aware their home may be at risk if they do not keep up repayments. Terms and conditions apply. Standard Variable rate may vary. Contents may not be as shown on box.

But even id they have restructed into a long term loan it would still show up on the balance sheet as "Creditors falling due after one year" and still result in the £-14m position as before :?

so we dont have debt to pay off?




They probably dont, but that doesnt mean the board have their hand in the till...

on the Brez deal (and yes, this might be considered a childish point scoring effort), should we sign him for the reputed negligible fee, and then later sell him at a profit, will the person responsible for contract dealings over the past summer at STFC be held responsible for the increased revenue?


Seriously though, it does now seem to have been a great piece of work, to have held Brezovan's name from other teams and get a loan deal with a small fee agreed (should he make the full reocvery we all hope for).  Well done to Wise and a n other(s).

is the money wills has put in a loan?
i thought it was donated,or owned as shares?

It's a mixture.

He wrote off £3m to £4m in the CVA.

He has in the main loaned the business money, or allowed his land to act as security for loans from other sources (mainly St Modwen).

I doubt if the loans are normal commercial rate loans though, more loans that don't attract monthly repayments but remain outstanding on the balance sheet.

He did underwrite a large share issue about 10 years ago, which I think (Reg will no doubt have the facts) was the time when he ended up acquiring the majority share holding.

You may be right, I'm just repeating what we were told, that it had been restructured so it was off balance sheet. Quite how that works (or even whether it does) I don't know.

you can have contingent loans, which are only repayable from future profits. As they don't have to be paid, they don't have to be shown on balance sheets

good point hans.

but    :ha:  STFC Future proifits

well exactly. But if it's a case of that or nothing...

god....this still going on in the Brezovan topic!
start a different thread please, i keep logging on and thinking there is news on Brez! :evil:

Hi. I have some news on Brezovan:

He is Slovakian.

I have copied an extract of the statement put out by someone at Dunwoody in the name of Diamandis during the summer. If we believe what he said then we should be able to piss signing up Brezovan even allowing for the alleged 750,000 overspend by Devlin and Power.  As I see things the gates are well up on last season, Diamandis told us we would £3-4 million up without Bill Powers money being put in and we are still in the shit? People like Diamandis cant go making wild statements like this and not expect serious questions. With one or 2 exceptions, fans are not stupid.


I found myself in the unenviable position of being responsible for putting the necessary resources together to ensure the club’s survival. The Wills family would not have continued to support the Club had I not been involved. Since then every year through one method or another, I have been able to raise approximately £750,000 a year to keep the Club going. During this period before Bill Power joined, more than £5.5 million was raised through my leadership, through my own company, with the dynamic share coming from the Wills’ family and St. Modwen.

Through successful negotiation we have been able to negotiate with all the creditors so that for the first time in the next month or so our balance sheet will go from a minus to a plus £3-4 million and, with Bill Powers total monies raised will top £6.5 million. The Club will still however require the average gate to rise for it to be safe and in the long term we do require a new stadium to ensure the future stability of the Club.

And Bob Holt said in the meeting with fans on 25 September that no funds had been obtained from any outside investors other than Power in the last 5 years

So doesnt this statement totally contradict that?

I'm not standing up for diamandis here, but to me that says the STFC operating shortfall has been funded mainly by the wills and partiailly by st modwen for the last few years, which we basically knew anyway

No it doesnt it says

"I have been able to raise £750k" regular to keep the club going. This and Sandy Grays comments at the fans forum last October suggested this as well.

Yet Holt said outside of the Wills family theonly money to come in has been through Bill Power who was brought in by Devlin.

Therefore Diamdnis has failed in the past 5 years to bring any investment into the club outside the Wills family

Thats the important part of the Diamandis statement. Only a couple of months ago we were apparently well in the black. WITHOUT BILL POWER PUTTING ANYTHING IN! So, why have we gone from that situation to one of being poor again and unable to sign Brezovan? Even if Devlin and Power pissed away 750k, according to Diamandis we should still be a couple of million in the black what with increased gates etc. So why are we now skint? Where has all the money gone?

jj

I really dont see what your point is. No-one - even diamandis himself - is claiming there has been any investment from anyone other than power

"with the dynamic share coming from the Wills’ family and St. Modwen."

I dont really know what dynamic share means in his context, I'm taking that as meanin "the vast majority"

I suspect the money was never physically there Delta. All that happened was the restruturing of loans etc with some clever accounting to make things look better on paper.

It would'nt change the reality of the clubs costs being too high unless all the loans had been written off altogether and interest was no longer being paid on them.

I'd be very interested to hear something from the club regarding this. as per ususal we are all just trying to have educated guesses.

Not read any of this (sorry) other than the title but the Trust MUST use all their funds to establish a place on the board, otherwise there's no point in signing anyone as we'll be fucked sooner rather than later

all the money in the world wouldnt get the trust a seat on the current board....

Sorry DV ........................ I disagree

ok, if they had all the money in the world they could buy the current board out...etc etc etc

but as long as the current lot are in charge the trust will not get a seat on board. Its been talked about for years and years and years about having a fans rep on the board....but it still hasnt happened.

Only one person has ever been for a fans rep on the board at this football club, and that man was Bill Power....

What a load of shit VD.

The blokes QPR through and through FFS.

re-read it cuntchops...

fuck off you hippie cunt. i'm right

Dont limit the lack of a space on the board just to the trust. Diamandis and Wills lot obviously dont want anyone else getting in or they would have buggered off years ago and let them take the financial losses. Power seemed to be accepted for a while as he had a few quid to spend. It didnt take them long to piss him off though - once they'd done his money of course. They specially dont want the trust though as they know that they would want to look at the books in detail (the last over reactive statement from the club testifies to that). They dont seem to like Mike Wilkes either. Seems like anyone who stands up to them and isnt afraid to question is an enemy somehow. They seem to do a thorough character assasination on anyone like that jus as they did recently with Paul Davis and Mike Wilkes. How can blokes who clearly love the club, go home and away and offer to help out, suddenly be turned into the fucking enemy ffs?
Does anyone know if I can join the trust on line? I cant see a link on their site.

Fill your boots sweetcheeks..

http://www.truststfc.co.uk/join.php

is that a 'im sorry for my mistake'?

 :D

Dave, the Red Army Fund is specifically ring-fenced to be used on players so we couldn't use it to buy a seat on the board even if we wanted to or the board would be willing to let us.

http://www.truststfc.co.uk/merchandise.php
Scroll to the bottom of the merchandise page and you can join online there (and buy a Pox relegation T-shirt while you're at it!)