Port Vile v Swindon pre match chat and matchday thread

[fuzzy]

Just a guide to how policing tends to be paid for.

Generally, police outside the ground, or the complex (think Adams Park where it is all behind a fence and gates), costs are met by the Police.

Officers inside the ground are funded by the club.

This therefore has an impact on what the club are willing to accept.

The cost per officer is not insignificant. I am trying to remember some of the numbers bandied around when I used to be involved. A quick dig around shows the recommended cost per officer per hour was £58.99 in 2018/19. This is for 6 hours per officer (the time needed to meet, travel, brief, deploy, do the job, travel, debrief, log off) which the club will be billed for so, £353.94 per PC. Sergeants and above are more expensive. Over £3.5k for 10 officers inside the ground. No wonder some smaller clubs (and bigger ones) balk at having reasonable numbers inside.

10 Officers outside the ground but working just for the football cost us, the tax payer exactly the same amount of additional cost.

Policing things like football with an element of risk of disorder are done with Police Support Units- PSU's. A PSU is 3 serials (vans). Each serial is 1 sergeant, one driver (PC) and 6 constables. Each PSU is led by an Inspector. Each event has a command structure of at least one Bronze commander (Inspector/ Chief Inspector) to deal with tactical decision making, and a Match Commander (Ch Insp/ Supt) to oversee the whole thing and liaise with other services, safety officer etc. There will generally be an accredited Public Order Tactical Advisor who is nationally accredited to offer advice and tactical options to the Match Commander. There will be dedicated evidence gatherers who are tasked with collecting visual and audio evidence of disorder. They are required to stand back and not get involved in hands on stuff as they will be lost to the task they specialise in whilst dealing with suspects and offenders. There may be dog handlers and mounted police (worth their weight in gold in disorder) plus other specialists like traffic units to speedily escort travelling fans coaches or team busses in and out of the arena.

It can very quickly mount up to 50 officers or more to police a game at Div 2/ 1 level if the risk assessment indicates there is a realistic chance of it kicking off. At a minimum of £350 per cop- a shitload of money.

Neither club chairmen or Chief Constables like the idea of loosing money 'best' spent elsewhere on policing a bunch of fuckwit morons wanting a bit of a flare up pissing contest at a sporting event.

[theakston2k]

Neither club chairmen or Chief Constables like the idea of loosing money 'best' spent elsewhere on policing a bunch of fuckwit morons wanting a bit of a flare up pissing contest at a sporting event.

So the innocent people inside the ground put at risk are just collateral damage and immaterial are they?

[singingiiiffy]

fuzzy, to be clear I'm not disputing numbers or how hard the job is. I have friends that are in the force. I'm disputing having 100 officers all around the pitch when all we needed was one line along the away fans at a distance from the stand.

a pitch invasion only becomes a problem when it isn't managed. protect the players, protect the away fans and let the home fans have their little run around as much as they want.

[ChalkyWhiteIsGod]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=374949101328262&id=100064395261175

Getting hammered in the comments section and rightfully so

[MangoRed]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=374949101328262&id=100064395261175

Getting hammered in the comments section and rightfully so

Good ol Swindon football police. The same Swindon police spotters that were present at the game yesterday, filming Swindon fans being assaulted instead of trying to intervene. Very, very strange bunch.

[Mr Stevens]

Coming to terms with last night and all very disappointing. Two things I would like to point out. Firstly, the problems with pitch invasions at Nottingham, Everton and Port Vale all stemmed from the 'fans' of the winning side. I haven't worked out how relevant that is.

Secondly, I really dislike the labelling of an entire fan base as vile scum etc. I'm certain that the vast majority of Vale fans are decent, passionate and well-behaved. I'd cite the vlogs of recent visitors to the County Ground, namely Vale, Scunthorpe and Walsall as examples of decent people going to a game.

We have our share as well. There was a certain amount of goading of visiting fans after the Sheffield United second leg and the priority of some people is not to celebrate the victory but to stimulate tension and violence.

I've got no answers though. Maybe the non-segregation of fans like Rugby Union?

[Jimmy HaveHave]

Not that I saw. Some bottles were thrown back and forwards but on the whole I think we were very restrained. A very small handful of people I think attempted to break seats to throw but I don't think that went anywhere.

Are we talking glass or plastic bottles?

[Jimmy HaveHave]

mentioning nonces in direct relation to policing football is a bit weird. that's no correlation. Knowing someone who worked in that area of policing, they are so under resourced the amount of time available on each case is depressing.

I'm not actually sure what the police can do, yet something more needs to be done. it happened at so many grounds this year where what should be  celebration turned into something else.

that pitch needed a line to clear then back though. and a presence on players. things could have been very ugly indeed

The answer is somewhere above put a moat all around the pitch if the thugs can't behave.

[Bob's Orange]

Are we talking glass or plastic bottles?

Is that a serious question? Plastic of course.

[Jimmy HaveHave]

Is that a serious question? Plastic of course.

Never been more serious idiots could easily smuggle glass bottles into the stadium.

[Formerly Drummer Boy]

Coming to terms with last night and all very disappointing. Two things I would like to point out. Firstly, the problems with pitch invasions at Nottingham, Everton and Port Vale all stemmed from the 'fans' of the winning side. I haven't worked out how relevant that is.

Secondly, I really dislike the labelling of an entire fan base as vile scum etc. I'm certain that the vast majority of Vale fans are decent, passionate and well-behaved. I'd cite the vlogs of recent visitors to the County Ground, namely Vale, Scunthorpe and Walsall as examples of decent people going to a game.

We have our share as well. There was a certain amount of goading of visiting fans after the Sheffield United second leg and the priority of some people is not to celebrate the victory but to stimulate tension and violence.

I've got no answers though. Maybe the non-segregation of fans like Rugby Union?

My views on last night that the unsavoury incidents are not isolated from what else we’ve seen this week and I hate to say it but if the shoe was on the other foot and if it had been at the County Ground, I’m not totally confident that a small minority of our fans would be giving us the negative headlines this morning. That said, anyone with a brain cell pre-game would have assessed the risks and built a safety strategy around circumstances. Anyone on the internet can see the tensions rising through the weeks with fans going at each other, McKirdy on the wind up.. Hell, even Clarke lost his head and got sent off… It was an emotionally charged atmosphere with a lot at stake but the safety planning was fuck all. We’ve seen it also at Stevenage too where poor safety and scenario planning/ execution led to unsavoury incidents. Don’t get me wrong, everyone needs to take responsibility to behave and be a decent human being. But plans needs to be in place to correct such behaviour and de-risk situations before they end up like they have this week.

In truth, I don’t think the EFL and FA have done anywhere near as much as they should be doing to give clubs enough guidelines, regulations and rules on how to build and execute such safety strategies.. IMO, there is more than evidence to suggest the EFL and FA are absolutely clueless and as a result deserve to be attributed with portions of blame to the stain of the game this week.

Clue the response being to brush it all under the carpet and ‘if it happens again, then….’ bluff. Toothless and spineless. When is that football regulator being implemented to hold the FA and EFL accountable?

[4D]

Is that a serious question? Plastic of course.

Seen someone say glass smashed on their seat

[Jimmy HaveHave]

Seen someone say glass smashed on their seat

That was behind my question and the reason why I asked

[Boeta]

FA need to get a grip.

£1k fine for anyone that enters the field of play

Points deduction for any club that allows 25+ people on the pitch.

[singingiiiffy]

Never been more serious idiots could easily smuggle glass bottles into the stadium.

correct at least one glass bottle was thrown 100%