Can the Plane take-off?

[timmyg]

If you put an aeroplane onto a treadmill, can it take off?

Let's say, for arguments sake, that there is an aeroplane and that you put this aeroplane onto a treadmill that is 100km long. As the aeroplane fires up the engines, so the treadmill starts up and keeps pace with aeroplane's engines.

Can it take off? Or will it just sit there like a lemon engines firing and wheels spinning but nothing happening?

[STFC Village]

Surely it would need to be actually travelling forward to give it lift?

[timmyg]

Yes, it would have to travel forward to give it lift, but would it be able to travel forward?

[STFC Village]

Depends on the speed of the treadmill

[timmyg]

The way I see it with my GCSE Physics is:

The treadmill can spin at whatever speed it likes and the plane will still take off just the same as if it was on a runway.

In theory, if the wheels are really, really good and lubed up, then friction can be taken as pretty much 0. so even without the engines on the treadmill will have zero effect on moving the plane. The wheels will spin, to be sure, but when you power up the engine the plane will move forward without any problems (and then take off).

[timmyg]

If the treadmill can be set to any speed and can be increased/decreased at any time.

[STFC Village]

The treadmill can spin at whatever speed it likes

Your original post says that the treadmill is keeping pace with the planes engines

[Bennett]

in order for it to gain lift it would need air passing over and under it's wing. that isn't going to happen unless u add a fan or eat lots of beans, even with either of those i doubt it, things in wind tunnels don't fly by themselves

[RobertT]

The way I see it with my GCSE Physics is:

The treadmill can spin at whatever speed it likes and the plane will still take off just the same as if it was on a runway.

In theory, if the wheels are really, really good and lubed up, then friction can be taken as pretty much 0. so even without the engines on the treadmill will have zero effect on moving the plane. The wheels will spin, to be sure, but when you power up the engine the plane will move forward without any problems (and then take off).

Which is the correct answer, I believe, according to some boffs who worked on this question.  The wheels simply spin at whatever speed they like on the treadmill, the body of the plane would still move forwards using the thrust of the engines.

[timmyg]

I get the whole 'it needs the wind to be blowing over its wings' thing, it's just that I think the plane CAN move forwards and hence get the lift needed to fly.

My argument is that the treadmill doesn't make any difference no matter what speed it's going.

If you have the treadmill going at 1,000 km/h then even with the engine off the plane is stationary, just the wheels are spinning right round, baby, right round at 1,000 km/h

Once you start up the plane's engines and set them to go at 10km/h the plane will move forwards at 10km/h, but the wheels will spin at 1,010 km/h.

[STFC Village]

Ah, i get it now. The wheels being a seperate force to the plane itself. Point fathomed