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With a new season in a better league upon us, does anyone think the players should be put through a hard pre season like Wise did last summer?

The players looked fit and sharp and we started well.

i'd imagine PS is building them up slowly so they don't burn out too quickly.

fitness needs to be built up and not forced. thats where injuries etc come from

I'm sure sturrock knows what he's doing.I'm not concerned at all about the players preparations

I just think a hard pre season did us good last year.

Macari used to do the same.

We lost our way after the start though, people seem to forget that.

How do you know they're not getting it hard?!


Ohh erh mrs...!

Macari and wise's methods were totally different.

Not really Ralph I think it would be better for all concerened if they sat around at home eating Pies.drinking beer and smoking and stuff.

Of course they'll be made to work hard and get fit!!

No need to snap people. I was just saying Wise's regime worked.

I hope Sturrock works them hard.

Well don't say it again..

I think making players do long cycles and runs are always great for players.  Whatever standard.

PS hasnt impressed me at all, but then we cant live in Wise era forever.  I rated Wise for his proffesionalism (sp) but then they are rare now nows.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premiership/reading/article2045404.ece

Thats a good article and also agree the science approach is a good one.  I also think running has never harmed a persons fitness

my mate ran Marathon's, had a heart attack.  I'm not sold on this fitness lark.  I'm with Yeovil, Sloth and Gluttony are the way forward.

Hearts are funny old things though, ive never understood how fit people get ill, pub is the way forward

both sloth and gluttony can be partaken within the confines of a pub, I'm in.  Get the players down the Toot and Whistle, buying rounds can replace set piece drills, requiring focus of the mind to ensure no spillage of multiple pints, the constant loo breaks should provide sufficient physical exercise, and the art of getting served quickly (might be best to move to the Dockle Farmhouse for this on) should ensure the players learn about the need for incisive movement.

Fuck me I must be a class player by now! Quality Rob

Lazy fuckers.

Even i run 6 miles a day.

ralphy for fitness coach, anyone?

not really, getting them to run for 6 miles every day would completely and utter fuck the players up good and proper and they'd be knackered after 10 minutes.

Playing football isnt like running a marathon, keeping at a steady pace for 90 minutes wont do anything. Its all about sprinting stop, start, stop, start, stop, start.

If you did alot of long distance running you're body and legs get condition to longevity and a steady pace, as soon as you start to spring you're knackered.

One year I tried to get fitter, ran 4 miles everyday for a good few months, got to playing football and didnt feel half as fit as I did before.

Plus, I dont want Ralphy as fitness coach because we'd seen 'Jerel Ifil blood soaked nipple stained training top' for sale on the official site!!!

dv for fitness coach, anyone?

Is it fuck, you ever seen him play, most quiet player on the pitch by a long shot.

I agree DV, what puzzles me is why long distance running doesn't help football.

Surely giving your lungs a good pounding, raising your heart rate and building leg muscle should help.

How do these players keep the weight off if they don't do much cardio work ?

two different kinds of muscle. I watched a documentary about it. Sprinters tend to have bulkier legs and long distance runners are quite slender in comparision. It is possible to be quite good at both with training but you basically have to choose.

This is why Linford Christie never ran long distance or why PissPants Paula wouldn't win the 100m.

I'm crap at sprinting but can run 10 km easy so that means i should have slender legs right?

This formula doesn't work.

It doesn't include fat legs Ralph...

 :wink:

Their solid as fuck !

 :)

I can be a loud mouth....although last time I played with you lot I was pretty ill.

Hell, I even shouted at Adie Williams to sort the tactics out when I was playing at the CG!!

I dont know the exact science, but your leg muscles just get conditioned to one or the other, if you do alot of one.

The muscles get built slightly differently or something.

Think it must be something to do with fast twitch and slow twitch muscle fibres. I can't really remember exactly but I think fast twitch are for endurance and slow for power. Could be the other way round I guess.

a central midfielder will have to be able to run and run and run,they cover loads of ground during a match.
i aint got a clue to the science of it all though

but not as the same pace through out the game....

If you're conditioned as a sprinter rather than a long distance runner, that doesnt mean you dont have the endurace for alot of running.

but footballers need to sprint at times and jog at different speeds at others.so what does that make them?

Footballers?

ah genius :D

Do we have any sport scientists on here ?

I'd be interested to learn about this being a runner myself.

again, being able to sprint rather than run marathons doesnt mean you cant run long distances.

I'm more a sprinter because I play alot of football, but I could still run 6 miles with Ralphy, he'd find it easier and do it in a better time but I'd probably still be able to complete it.

I guess its getting a fine balance.

I'm sure Ralphy can sprint as well, but again I'd find it easier and be able to go it more often, quicker and over long distances.

i doubt i could run 600 yards let alone 6 miles.and aint played footy for over 3 years

even a Marathon runner should do a variety of running excercises.  I know my mate used to build up the total running length as the months got closer to an event, but never ran more than about 20miles in one go.  He also did hill reps and 400m reps.

I would guess a footballer would do a lot of shorter style reps.  It's at close to full pace and by repeating you'd build up the general level of fitness/stamina.  Throw in the odd longer run.

Ralphy, it takes a long while for your legs to get thin, and probably by running a bit more than 6 miles every day.  What I would say is he never bloody looked healthy when training for Marathon's.

I don't have the build of a sprinter, too slow off the mark.

I find running along at a steady 8 mph for an hour easy though.

I think natural build has something to do with it.  My mate is into adventure racing, and is tall but slightly built and very good at 5k+. I'm his height, but heavily built and unfit, but over 50yards I'd have him in a sprint becase I think my body is better built for that.

interesting, very interesting. what about those runners who run up walls and jump off buidings and things, what's the best physique for that?

that's what i want to do.

Free running?  your build doesn't matter, having no brains and balls of steel is key!

Free running is ace. I like to do it when I'm drunk. and sometimes when I'm sober. But that just tends to be running along the wall of my front garden on the way out of my house.

So that means Pook must have good lungs and be quite fit to be a Wanker!

I did Sports studies A level and its something to do with fibre types that make up a muscles. Sportsmen that do short explosive actions such as a sprint build up 'fast twitch' fibres which give power but not endurance. Black athletes naturally have more fast twitch fibres hence they rip us to pieces when it comes to sprinting. 'Slow twitch' fibres provide the endurance but with football requiring explosive bursts I think it consumes alot more energy or something along those lines. So basically I think long runs result in the wrong type of muscle fibre building up and is unsuitable for football.
Heart wise as the heart is a muscle that needs to be trained and built up just like normal muscles. It needs to be trained to either provide short bursts of energy or steady endurance. Some swimmers have trained there heart to the extent where the heart rate is something stupid like 10 beats per minute which is astounding.

Recovery times are the most important indicators of actual fitness levels, the quicker you recover the fitter you are. I would imagine scientific testing would include measuring the time it takes to return to a resting heartrate after exercise to provide an indicator.

does anyone agree that glos robin sounds like he is making all that up?

It's actually all true  :D

glos robin for fitness coach, anyone?

On a bit of a tangent here but with the heart being a muscle and needing training etc why isnt taking speed considered a good heart work out?

Seriously?

It is yeovil, they just keep it quiet.

class yeovil, get 20 wraps and take it to the training ground

I think it's a work out too far for the heart.

Say no to drugs kids.

Stick to the fags and alcohol..........................

Recovery times not very pleasant either.

I think we need an official tef stance on this. Something like...

"The tef encourages experimentation with all substances, but only in moderation - Don't Get Addicted Now!!! Apart from with cigarettes and alcohol, with them you can go fucking crazy. It's part of the tef way."

Any suggestions?

Glos Robin, when i've finished a 10 km run on the treadmill, my heart rate is 155 bpm.

After 5 mins of stopping, it drops to 100 bpm.

Is that good?

Moderation?> boooooooooooooooooooo

lebowski unfortunately its true, I had my head filled with all this rubbish...

Ralphy it depends what your resting heart rate is as doubt 100bpm is your resting level. Your body might be able to replenish energy levels quickly to a certain extent, but the real test is how long it takes to return to normal. Generally swimmers have the slowest heart rates like I said, even stupidly low in some cases, I believe that whacko David Blain trained his heart rate to be stupidly low.  
Getting to 155 is fat burn territory so is pretty good but you need to monitor your recovery time, the shorter time it takes after exercise to return to your resting heart rate then the fitter you are. You should aim to try for VO2 max sometime which is around the 170 bpm and then measure your recovery as that is the real test.  What is your resting Heart rate then below 50 bpm is marathon runner levels. My best was around 56bpm when I used to play tennis every day so am far from that now.... someone could get to 155 bpm and then take a day to recover which would be pretty awful.

My resting heart rate is always between 45-50 bpm.

It depends on age also doesn't it?

155 bpm is too high for fat burn in a 25-30 year old.

Fat burn for my age is probally 120-140 bpm.

The older you get, the lower your heart rate is needed for exercise.

A 70 year old could do 90 bpm and that would be considered fat burning right?

Well your in marathon runner territory then, which sounds about right judging from the amount of running you say you do. The stronger you make your heart obviously the fewer beats you require as each heart beat is more powerful pumping more blood meaning the need for less beats.
I would suggest though if you tried playing football and doing that for 90 minutes you wouldn't feel to good after, as people have said there are all different kinds of fitness. For football a specialist form of circuit training is the norm involving repetitive quick bursts

following on from ralphy's query... if i run further than, oooooo, 200 metres my teeth really start hurting. why is this? does that mean im burning fat?

If I go for Nozza's wanking record, will that be like marathon runner fitness territory?

I've noticed one arm is getting bigger than the other. Is this normal? Would this happen to a marathon runner?

If you say you resting heart rate is below 50 you should easily be able to reach a VO2 max of around 170 if you do a really heavy session which would be around 90% of your supposed maximum intensity. The minimum you'd want to do is 135bpm and you should be able to reach anything upto 180bpm....as a compromise I'd aim for somewhere between 160 and 170

Cheers.

I've been running for about 6 years now so my heart rate has dropped alot.

I would beat you in a race Ralphy  :P

Hmmmm i can't think of a response to this.  :soapy tit wank: