Let's Get Political!

[horlock07]

Are you relaxed about this because?:
a) due process was followed
b) you're cool with fracking
c) it's not in your back yard
d) all of the above.

As I said before I know nothing of the process nor safety of fracking, however probably a) working in the sector its what we all have to deal with, why should fracking be any different - unless there is an environmental/safety reason but if so why has it already been approved in Yorkshire?

Its big news in North Lancashire as there is a large middle class green voting community up here who are very good at making a noise.

[Red Frog]

As I said before I know nothing of the process nor safety of fracking, however probably a) working in the sector its what we all have to deal with, why should fracking be any different - unless there is an environmental/safety reason but if so why has it already been approved in Yorkshire?

Its big news in North Lancashire as there is a large middle class green voting community up here who are very good at making a noise.

Was just curious as I know you're not far away, and I think I'd be motivated to try and find out more if it was on my doorstep. This is the sort of stuff your green-voting, middle-class neighbours will be reading:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/27/fracking-digging-drilling-paris-agreement-fossil-fuels

Do you think this, and they, are wrong to be making a noise?

[horlock07]

Was just curious as I know you're not far away, and I think I'd be motivated to try and find out more if it was on my doorstep. This is the sort of stuff your green-voting, middle-class neighbours will be reading:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/27/fracking-digging-drilling-paris-agreement-fossil-fuels

Do you think this, and they, are wrong to be making a noise?

Now somewhat further away than I was, but that's by the by.

As I said earlier the big problem is finding out information that is independent and not biased, the article you have linked actually seems to get to the crux of the issue in that its just extracting another fossil fuel to be burnt which is a whole different argument.

As with many nationally important decisions successive governments rather than adopting a policy on the matter are just sitting on their hands expecting it to be controlled through the planning system which is entirely the wrong place to do it, if we don't want fracking as a nation well just ban it, however from what I know about the case (And this is purely professional interest on the planning side) is that it should never have been refused by the Council on planning grounds in the first place.

I also probably bit a little regarding the idea of planning committees being democratic after a long meeting yesterday with another council where democracy regarding planning matters is very obviously not there, where a member of the public of influence is imposing their views on a scheme and the Council are just giving them carte blanche.......

[chalkies_shorts]

On what basis?

Does a bit of work for Corbyn which appears to be universally acclaimed as a whitewash, is given a peerage by him, never been an MP and then invited into the shadow cabinet - all in a matter of months. Makes me form the opinion of being bought by Corbyn and selling her soul. I could be wrong but its not an illogical conclusion to draw.

[jayohaitchenn]

Theresa May occupying the political centre ground by announcing all foreign workers are going to be made to wear gold stars, dividing children into their proper classes at 11 years old is a good idea and British troops can behave how they jolly well like.

[horlock07]

Theresa May occupying the political centre ground by announcing all foreign workers are going to be made to wear gold stars, dividing children into their proper classes at 11 years old is a good idea and British troops can behave how they jolly well like.

The first 10 minutes of this is an interesting listen

[pauld]

Does a bit of work for Corbyn which appears to be universally acclaimed as a whitewash, is given a peerage by him, never been an MP and then invited into the shadow cabinet - all in a matter of months. Makes me form the opinion of being bought by Corbyn and selling her soul. I could be wrong but its not an illogical conclusion to draw.

Erm, OK, but loathsome seems a bit OTT. Can understand it for Abbott, or for Blair, Jack Straw, George Osborne etc etc, not sure Chakrabati merits it for a bit of greasy pole climbing. Not sure there's anyone in politics would escape your censure if that's your criteria.

[chalkies_shorts]

Erm, OK, but loathsome seems a bit OTT. Can understand it for Abbott, or for Blair, Jack Straw, George Osborne etc etc, not sure Chakrabati merits it for a bit of greasy pole climbing. Not sure there's anyone in politics would escape your censure if that's your criteria.

I think her route in has been different to most. I think the way its been done stinks to high heaven. Just my opinion. Loathsome still works for me.

[pauld]

I think her route in has been different to most. I think the way its been done stinks to high heaven. Just my opinion. Loathsome still works for me.

So what words do you use to describe politicians who start illegal wars, turn a blind eye to torture or make the disabled pay for the fuck-ups of the banks (and other politicians)?

[Saxondale]

Lovable rogues?

[chalkies_shorts]

So what words do you use to describe politicians who start illegal wars, turn a blind eye to torture or make the disabled pay for the fuck-ups of the banks (and other politicians)?

Loathsome and in some cases loathsome criminals. What words do you use to describe someone brought in to turn a blind eye to a party that tolerates anti Semitic, whitewashes it and then gets rewarded considerably for doing so. Granted, its not in the same league as starting illegal wars but its pretty loathsome to me.  

[pauld]

Loathsome and in some cases loathsome criminals. What words do you use to describe someone brought in to turn a blind eye to a party that tolerates anti Semitic, whitewashes it and then gets rewarded considerably for doing so. Granted, its not in the same league as starting illegal wars but its pretty loathsome to me. 

Fair enough. I think I'm just being pedantic about your early overescalation

FWIW, I don't think Chakrabati did whitewash her report, but I agree Labour, and the left in general, has a massive issue with turning a blind eye to (and in some cases actively encouraging) anti-Semitism. Israel, and the Middle East in general, has long been the Left's blind spot, where well-meaning anti-colonialism and irrational anti-Americanism collides with the anti-racism the Left purports to subscribe to and all too often principle gives way to prejudice.

Incidentally as a UKIP voter, what are you hoping to get out of leaving Europe?

[horlock07]

Treading very carefully here - but I have not read much about it, but from the limited stuff that's been in the media has the 'anti-Semitism' gone beyond people expressing anger at the manner in which Israel is acting towards Palestine (which has nothing really to do with religion and more to do with expansion, aggression and ignoring the UN)? Just asking as whilst I am no fan of Corbyn's in the slightest a lot seems to stem from his support for the Palestines - not trying to provoke a row but just asking the better informed?

WRT to Chakrabarti no idea if it was a whitewash or not, but does seem a little too convenient that she was bought in, wrote report, elevated to the Lords (which Corbyn had claimed he would never do) and then ends up in cabinet, although I suspect she is better qualified than many of the 2015 intake who have been elevated way beyond their experience as they a) supported Corbyn and b) he could find no one else to fill posts. Possibly the ire should be directed more at Jeremy?

[chalkies_shorts]

Incidentally as a UKIP voter, what are you hoping to get out of leaving Europe?

A better element of control. I think I've said before if I'm going to screw up my life, I'd rather do it myself than have 27 others do it for me while I can see it happen but have my arms tied behind my back. Maybe not the best analogy.
There is no doubt there are plans to integrate and expand further and further-  European army, Turkey etc. This will be done by stealth as it has been so far. I don't like it and don't want it.
The EU is pretty much starting to fall apart anyway with North, South and Eastern divides.
I believe we can very strongly stand on our own feet better than being part of a club. I might be wrong, I might be right. That's the gamble.

[pauld]

A better element of control. I think I've said before if I'm going to screw up my life, I'd rather do it myself than have 27 others do it for me while I can see it happen but have my arms tied behind my back. Maybe not the best analogy.
There is no doubt there are plans to integrate and expand further and further-  European army, Turkey etc. This will be done by stealth as it has been so far. I don't like it and don't want it.
The EU is pretty much starting to fall apart anyway with North, South and Eastern divides.
I believe we can very strongly stand on our own feet better than being part of a club. I might be wrong, I might be right. That's the gamble.

Fair enough (again) - I share a lot of your misgivings there. Although you won't have any control at all. Just the UK elite may get some control back from a European elite.

How happy are you about all the shit that seems to come with Brexit? How chuffed were you that the Brexit lot didn't actually seem to have any plan whatever on how to implement it?
And as someone who voted for them have you signed any of the petitions (or written an email or whatever) asking the Brexit liars to actually keep some of their promises (£350m pw to the NHS was promised vs yet another massive round of cuts, which is what we're actually getting)?