Thetownend.com

The opponent:  Scunthorpe United

Here we are the last regular game of the season which for me has gone as fast as any season I can remember. There have been some up’s. Portsmouth away springs to mind, Tranmere too, even Shrewsbury and their pwoper nawty lads was fun. At home, the run over the festive period springs to mind and a couple of other quick to forget wins. The downs?  Where would I start? Well I won’t. We will all have our own opinions of where it all went wrong, what could have been done differently and whose fault everything is. To be honest I am not too sure  it did go wrong. Yes, everything could have been done so much differently but at the start of the season I would have taken the play offs with a game to spare every day of the week. What happens in the next few weeks could make us or break us some say, who knows, but either way, if the last 9 or so months is anything to go by then the play offs should be another rollercoaster of emotions!

Scunthorpe, named in 2005 as the British town with the most unattractive name, are today’s hosts. Scunthorpe was close to the epicentre (this was centred at Ludford, near Louth) of one of the largest earthquakes experienced in the British Isles on 27 February 2008, with a magnitude of 5.2. Significant shocks were felt in Scunthorpe and the surrounding North Lincolnshire area. The main 10-second quake, which struck at 00:56 GMT at a depth of 9.6 mi (15.4 km), was the biggest recorded example since one with a magnitude of 5.4 struck north Wales in 1984. This is allegedly the most exciting thing to have ever happened in the history of North Lincolnshire.

One of the most famous sons to ever claim Scunthorpe as their home is former the England manager and pundit Graham Taylor. Other fairly well known faces from the area are Buzzcocks guitarist Howard Devoto, Golfer Tony Jacklin and all round annoying late night talk show host, Ian Collins.

What are they saying about us? –

re: Swindon will field strong side
“We have 8 first team players who are garbage,so guess it's anyone's game..”

http://boards.footymad.net/forum.php?tno=460&fid=12&sty=2&act=1&mid=2112834068

Scunthorpe Last 6 –  WLLDWL (Currently 21st in League 1, needing victory today to have any hope of survival).

The Threat – Karl Hawley is about all they have with 10 goals in 39 games. I think the main threat they are likely to possess today is the willpower they have to get the 3 points that they need to give themselves even the slightest chance of survival.

The irrelevant stats – The Irons home form plays a large part in the position they currently find themselves in. In the 22 times they have played at Glanford Park this season they have won 6, drawn 6 and lost 10.

A Warm Welcome To – Left back Callum Kennedy (how much better has his replacement been?) signed for Scunthorpe when we released him last month.

Head to Head – In the 19 previous encounters between us, we have won 7, drawn 7 and lost 5.

The Odds –  Scunthorpe 9/5  Draw 5/2   Swindon 13/8 There could be some goals in this, even if we are playing Curly Withers and Don Rogers upfront. 2-2 looks good at 16-1. All odds from Bet Victor.

The Son Says – Once I explained to him the importance of a win for Scunthorpe he decided we would win 3-0.

The Prediction –  Ok, we have made the play offs so what kind of a team will we put out? Injuries will obviously play a big part in KMac’s selections but I still think we will have enough to win 2-1.

And Finally – In 1996 there was controversy when AOL's obscenity filter (among others) refused to accept the name of the town due to its inclusion of the embedded word CUNT, which the filter rejected as obscene. Some online forums such as Ultimate Guitar forums (which has recently been resolved) display the name as S****horpe, while Fark.com would display it as Scoonthorpe. This form of censorship overreach is known in the computing world as the Scunthorpe problem 

COYR COYR COYR

Good reporting as ever SR, enjoyed the matchday threads this season! I think we'll send them down and win 3-1, in front of 5,492 with 600 Town fans (despite their £5 a ticket they don't really have much chance of staying up I don't think!) Goals from Williams (2) and Rooney A, C.O.Y.R!!!

Oops

2 - 0 us

Well spotted. Its been a long season Fred  :(

True

Still a good read though mate

I liked Kennedy a lot. Quite annoyed we just let him go. Always thought he was better than Jaymac.

If we field a first team,first I'll be infuriated with Kmac, and then go for a 2-0 win.

If we field our 'reserves' (yoof and low-appearance first-teamers), could well be a 2-0 for the Scunts. Depends how bad our lads want it as opposed to just enjoying the run-out.

2-2

1-2

(kennedy; williams, devera)

Guaranteed Kennedy will score if he plays. Hoping we can win and get a home tie for the second leg of the playoffs.

This game is massive, only maximum points will do.

http://thetownend.com/samdygray/PredictionLeague/

Scunthorpes main threat will be set pieces ala Doncaster,Cut out the silly mistakes and we'll win 4-1 no matter what team we put out,would like io see Conor Walden get 20 or 30 mins, looked good last week

0-0.  Despite something to play for in terms of positioning within the playoffs this is just a game to get over and done with.

More interested in the bottom of League 2 this afternoon TBH

Scunthorpe need to win in order to have any chance of staying up and we'll no doubt rest up a bit (and wisely so) then I predict a scrappy 1-0 defeat.

Must win game

Well today is a gosh darn toughy.

Beat Scunthorpe and we play a team in the P-O's of similar ability to us (over a season).

Lose to Scunthorpe and we play a team in the P-O's of similar ability to us (over a season)... and possibly send Colchester down in the process.

I'm opting to lay back with my mind on my money and my money on my mind.

[url width=253 height=287]http://gifs.gifbin.com/042010/1271419049_snoop-dogg-morphing.gif[/url]

First game this season that I'm really not fussed on the result even though i'm enroute to the game. Would like a win but also feel we could do Scunny a favour by losing. Either way want us to be at home for the first leg of the play offs.

Fuck, that gif is not helping my hangover...  :puke:

This!

This is one of my closest games this season & when I saw the fixture list last year I thought it may have turned out to be one of those great days!  A little bit anti-climatic to be honest, but I reckon we'll beat them with a mixed team of youth & 1st teamers, they really are crap, although they should be fighting for survival!  Expect about 400 to travel it's a long trip & the POs are just round the corner.

Kennedy is injured

Over 500 sold in advance.

Anticlimactic ... it's anticlimactic ... http://grammarist.com/usage/climactic-climatic/

Don't know what to think about this one, pretty much like the rest of my predictions! I'll go for 1-1 with Rooney netting.

No more injuries and I will be happy.

Just setting off to the train station now, not looking forward to the two mile walk at the other end as I will probably get lost  ::)

Do you have a maps app on your phone? You could always use that.

I do, but for reasons unknown it has never worked. route seems simple enough though and i'm not too pissed so should be okay

to top it off it's now pissing it down :cry:

As long as we can get out if them game without any injuries or suspensions that will be a result.

And even though it is relatively close have decided to give it a miss. Saving my money for the Play Off games.

PS I remember the earthquake, we felt the shake in Peterborough to the extent that it woke me up that night.

Not really bothered what the score is... No injuries and suspensions would be lovely and maybe a goal for one of the young lads off the bench.

Beautiful day on Chesil Beach Soapy Tit Wank

I was going to go and spend £30 and watch Lillestrøm in the glorious sunshine this afternoon before decided that it's far too expensive to watch a bunch of crap Norwegians fall over a lot so instead it's the joys of STFCPlayer for me.

Nothing riding on it, so gave it a miss.

Not bothered who we get in the Poffs we will be least fancied so ...whatever....we have a ticket for the lottery whatever.

Warminster Reserves today....

TOWN v Scunthorpe: Foderingham; Devera, Flint, Ward, Byrne; De Vita, McCormack, Luongo, Roberts; Collins, Rooney A

How has De Vita kept his place ffs?! :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Would you have kept him on the bench then?

After weeks of shite performances from him, yes.

A winger who can't beat a full back!

I hope nobody breaks a leg.

Think I'd have given Fodders a rest, only because I'm afraid of him getting sent off and missing the playoffs given his recent (fortunate) near misses in that regard. Interesting how some players (Fodders and Darren Ward especially) have got notably sloppier under the new regime and others (Aden Flint, Adam Rooney) seem to have stepped up and become notably better.

Bar the last couple of matches, Flint has been all over the place at times under Kmac - Brentford away in particular.

Not really fussed by result but may as well relegate Scunthorpe while we are there.

Anybody got a player login i can use please?

Looking like Wolves could be league 1 next year at this rate.

Yeovil 1 down

Operation 'I quite fancy finishing fourth' is underway...Bury 1-0 Yeovil.

Bale Hotspur 1 up then...

I fucking hate STFCPlayer.

Ha Wigan have equalised against Bale Hotspur

Shitty are going to L1 with a whimper...

City 2-0 down now oh dear!

Regardless of today's result, you cannot underestimate how terrible they are.

Should we fail to go up I look forward to locking horns with The Shit Heads next season.

Yet they managed to draw 0-0 away at Hull last week, a team that are on the verge of the Premier League

I was looking at the Championship table last night, and there was only 15 points between Bolton in 6th and Barnsley in 23rd.

Bury 2-0 Yeovil

Not necessarilly according to Watford.  Did you see the goal that they spanked in last night?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=u2thdHhnucU

That went in like a tracer bullet. Passed Schmeichel before he moved.

I'd put that down to a nervous Hull City because Bristol City are ludicrously rubbish. I've seen enough of them this season to reach that conclusion.

Nothing against Wolves but I'm also very keen for this to be true...

2011–12: Wolves are in the Premier League
2011-12: Swindon are in League Two

2013-14: Wolves are in League One
2013-14: Swindon are in The Championship

I really do quite like the idea of finishing fourth...having been at Brammall Lane, I want to get back there, too.

Roberts header disallowed for offside.

He was well off, to be fair.

Bury 3 Yeovil 0

Irrelevant unless we win tho'

Doncaster or Sheffield is going to be a right shitter for me to get to. Can't afford it. Yeovil is affordable.

In that case...I have a cunning plan...

Whereas I feel quite the opposite.  Yeovil is fucking ballache of the highest order (for me) to get to (and get tickets for).

Ideally Preston get at least a draw from SheffU and we score then?

Brentford will be acceptable. Cheap tickets on the Megabus coach and family in London if they let me stay.

Yes

0-0 HT

"As it stands"-is there a more meaningless phrase in football?

Should have went. 3-2 up with 30 minutes to go.

Tickets for Brentford or Yeovil away might not get to the general sale stage

I'm having much more fun listening to the quality sound from Player and putting together spreadsheets

They definitely won't!

I'd sooner have Brentford over Yeovil, just because Yeovil is an awful away day.

Precisely.  I'll be on here on the scrounge, if needs be.  Still hoping for Brammall Lane.

What's the temperature there? Looks glorious!

After the other week. FUCK NO!

For selfish reasons alone I would like Donny or Sheff Utd, the least favoured option would be Yeovil.

I really would want to try & get down there on a Bank Holiday weekend

It was about 11 when I went out earlier. BBQ on the veranda this afternoon :-)

That's why...I have some demons to exorcise...

Keeping on topic. Come on you Reds!


I'm not getting embroiled in in-fighting

Eh?

wOLVES 0-2

Love it if they went down

Is there nothing happening or is my phone not refreshing?

:zzz:

Nothing much happening tbh game being played in the midfield mainly

Not a great deal it seems from the commentary...had a couple of chances 2nd half though

Ta. Heading to BBC wilts range now. Really could do with playing home on Monday. Coyr

Colchester have scored so poor ol' Scunthorpe are doomed regardless at the moment.

Nothing game.

Time to gives a few of the kids 15-20minutes

Williams coming on...

And Miller, meh...

Dont you like Wolves?

Get in Collins

Get in!

Hooray!

Ooh pitch invasion by Scunny!  Agro apparently

Pitch invasion

Queue Sheff utd scoring and finishing 5th!

Battons drawn

Get the fuck in. Nice bit of momentum for the play off push.

Lets hope all results stay same now

pitch invasion :eek:

Brilliant stuff, funny as fuck.

No!  Come on Sheff U! (he said selfishly)

FA will blame it on us.

Did swindon run onto the pitch first?

No all Scunny

Fuck, 1-1

Luke Rooney on...

Bollocks

Looks like the pitch invasion had the desired effect

Boo, would have preferred the home leg second...

Boooo

Imagine if Scunthorpe fans cared THAT much about Swindon in the Play-Offs :)

Eric must be in the Scunthorpe end

No Wes, please no red card.

Fuck it...

FFS Pen

Fuck sake. Brentford. Nightmare.

Penalty to scunny, Wes again...

2-1 Scunny.  Brentford it is then

Well done Town.

bollocks, Brentford are hard to beat.

Fuck sake.

Wtf...

Only Swindon could go from getting a second leg at home to Yeovil to playing Brentford in a few minutes.

Bollocks.

Wes has been shit the last few weeks. There i said it

Bring back Lanzano, he's probably on the dole back in Italy!

Yeah not a good turnaround there!

Bloody hell Wes-3 potential reds in 3 games,lucky boy!

FFS - 3-1

Offs.

Well. That's a confidence drainer going into the playoffs. :headhurts:

Typical Town.

Good old Swindon.

Fucks sake, really don't fancy Brentford.

soapy tit wank

Wes is so clumsy

At least we don't have to put up with the agony of losing at Wembley.

people seem pretty upset at us losing when everyone was saying it was a nothing game

It appears to be a matter of time before he gets sent off.

Obviously haven't seen this one, but in every game recently he has had one total headfit, which could have cost us a goal or led to him being sent off

What a shit way to go into the playoffs against the team that will most likely win them.  Well done, boys, you've really fucked that up.

Just what we need before the play offs.

If we were going to lose and finish 6th we should have just sent the kids out there...

 It's quite funny really

PENALTY TO BRENTFORD

 :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Brentford Pen!! could be donny!!

Donny !!!!

So what happens with wes as he was booked? is that 5 yellows?

Doncaster, much better.

Donny better than Brentford. They'll be hurting after that.

the pitch invasion couldn't have helped our team much.

didn't matter if we won, lost or drew. the play-offs are a lottery and we're the worst team of the 4 anyway

Missed, for fucks sake!

Brentford still playing

will we be at home 0n Friday now :hmmm:

FFS Brentford.

Donny Score

Fucksake,

Donny, no missed and they score...

Ghahahahahahaha. Donny win title

This late collapse is a slight worry but only Swindon fans can whine about this. A few weeks ago we were moaning because we going to drop out of the top 6.

None of them are any different to us and the previous 46 matches no longer matter.

Nope brentford it is! easier to get to, they are going to be crushed now after that as well!

Haha wtf is going on

brentford penalty Hit the post donny break and score 1-0 doncaster

what the fuck is going on?

Was it at Doncaster where we didn't have a shot on target?

Haha, what a great last few minutes, Brentford must be gutted, could help us!

Unbelievable at Griffin Pk, penno to Brentford, they hit the bar, Donnie go up other end and score.

 :D :D :D :D

bloody hell! not a bad way to win the title

Things can only improve.

Bournemouth must be feeling sheepish about demanding that Tranmere host them as champions

I'm sure we'd have to beat Brentford to win the playoffs, even if we didn't face them in the semis.

Quite glad we get to play them at our place, we have every chance of winning.

Possibly 3rd to Champions in 10 seconds.....

Heart attack city!

That could hurt Brentford big time

It doesn't matter though because they're playing Swindon next...

lolololololololololololololololololol

Yep, and that moved them from thrid & in the play-offs, to be Champions as Bournemouth had only drawn at Tranny

well, that escalated quickly

Can anyone with a season ticket not going to Brentford get me a couple?  All help gratefully received. :)  (Beer paid for help!)

Black cost us the league title, I am convinced of it. We would have won it I'm sure.

did i misunderstand or are RS reporting that we'll be playing sheff utd?

To be honest our performance at Brentford was far better than the one at Sheff Utd.Thought we should have won at Griffin Park

Yep

Although Bournemouth went up (and fair play to them), I smiled as Doncaster clinched the title.

Didn't need the presentation in Tranmere after all.

Well at least boremuff didn't win the title

I don't care who we get in the semis. I'd rather my hopes dashed in the semis than another shitty day out at wembley.

you misunderstood

especially after their wanker chairman was demanding they were allowed to have the presentation there.

Fucking hell, talk about mental!

Great that Bournemouth don't get the title though, but more importantly, Brentford will be shot to pieces after squandering that chance to go up automatically. Will surely play into our hands.

Can only be a good thing for us.

yup.  PdC+Ritchie = promotion.

We still have a chance. Expectations low but that may help.

Please can someone confirm who we are playing and when?  I'm away at the moment and struggling to access any sites other than this one to find out?  Where did we finish?

http://www.afcb.co.uk/news/article/2013-04-24-cherries-confirm-open-top-bus-parade-790603.aspx

 :D

I'm inclined to agree.

Now we'll cause a shock in the Semi-Finals (see Charlton Athletic, 2010).

...and then lose at Wembley to the previous seasons Play-Off Final losers (see Millwall, 2010).

"Swindon Town will face Brentford at the County Ground in the first leg of their League One play-off semi on Sat, May 4. Kick-off 5.20pm.

The second leg of the tie will be at Griffin Park on Monday, May 6 at 1.30pm."

Any season ticket holders not going to Brentford,please please can you get me a ticket or 2?My gratitude will overwhelm you!

I'll ask again, How many yellow cards is wes on as he got booked today

We're playing at home on Saturday, as Sheff Utd cannot play then, as Wednesday are at home.

That was his 4th of the season.

on an optimistic note,if we beat Brentford we have a bloody good chance in the final

Thanking you. Wondering if yellow cards are wiped for playoffs

Oi! I asked first! :)

Just saw the Brentford pen. Smashed it onto the underside of the bar but bounced out..

I have an inkling that they are but not certain

Got a bad feeling now Brentford could blow us away over these two legs after what's happened to them today. Surely can't get much lower than what happened to them and will be fired up for the play-offs.

More likely they're going to be mentally shell shocked. We know how well Douglas captains sides in the play-offs.

I hope that Brentford will be crushed by what has gone on today and think to them selves this is just not their year, we have a 1 in 4 chance and we have the players to win, just see if we can.

Fuck Brentford. We will win.  ::)

So let me get this straight, we were leading 1-0 with about 6 mins to play and the conceded 3 goals?  WTF?!  And what is wrong with Foderingham lately?  How he hasn't got a red card is nothing short of miraculous.

Not that I really care, but did Scunthorpe stay up?

Us and Brentford seem to have drawn the short straw though with games being moved around to accommodate Sheffield Utd.  Two games in less than 24 hours is tough going for a threadbare squad like ours.

Nope, they went down.

Barnet went out the football league.

Fat boy Evans went up to league 1.

we went 1-0 up and there was a pitch invasion by the Scunthorpe fans, delayed play for a bit and police were out with batons. Play resumed and we fell apart.

It's irrelevant now anyway, it's play off time

Brentford have shown themselves to be very hard to score against, we're going to need our defence back! The one we had for 18 months under Di Canio.

Errrrm, they can get knocked out by us in the play offs? That's much lower!

To be fair Scunnie should be heavily fined for that. Wankers.

imagine if it had cost us a PO position or automatic promotion, there's little doubt that the pitch invasion turned the game

Exactly, our club always bangs on about no pitch invasions after the match, let alone during a match. This should be dealt with very seriously, cost us a semi v Yeovil.

Thanks for the clarification Batch and SY.  Conceding 3 goals not ideal prep though irrelevant if the pitch invasion unsettled things. What if Brentford fans do the same?

The switch to Saturday is a bit of a pain as well.  For the first time ever, I don't feel excited at being in the POs.  Not good, but perhaps a natural defence mechanism against what I think is probably going to happen  :(

I can't make the Saturday, and bugger knows if I'll be able to get an away ticket :(

Didn't Digby's last tenure as GK coach also coincide with Brezonan going from looking a very solid and reliable prospect to suddenly becoming sloppy and error prone as well?

 :hmmm:

Might be making that up. Input from anyone with a better memory appreciated.

I thought Brezovan was never really the same after his arm break

Digby out!

Brez obviously had his broken arm by the time he came back the previous keeper coach (name escapes) had followed Wise to Leeds and we had Granville (I think)

Afaik KMac hasn't bought in anymore backroom staff aside from Cooper which worries me tbh.

When you're looking to save money, then it's only to be expected, that the backroom staff will be as small as possible.

Which is why I was surprised reading about the meeting in the week, that apparently we have a media manager person lurking in the background.

plenty of handbags in the car park afterwards and the satisfying sound of baton on spine :D

Just got back.  Strange game in a strange atmosphere.

We lacked in nearly every department today, only Collins & Ward earned any credit imo.  Although fighting for possible survival, Scunthorpe are a poor team, who really wanted it today, right up to the end.

I've no idea why Roberts goal was disallowed or what the penalty was for?  Ref didn't give it we all thought it was a corner.  Da Vita is a shadow of himself these days and looked completely 2nd rate.  I'm not sure how the POs will pan out, but we're a million miles from being a Championship side.

I've no idea what the formation was following the subs today, I presume he went for 5 across midfield? Not sure why as we didn't bother with a midfield prior to that.

The pitch invasion was as a result of a small section of Scunny fans & the right section of Town throwing their usual banter at each other, then we scored! I think (I was behind the goal to the left) our fans wanted to get a bit closer & it got a bit out of control, very few stewards or Police in the vacinity.  This sparked a stampede of about 50 odd "kids for a fiver" Brigade to race over from the far end.  Delayed the game for 2-3 minutes.

All round shit away day again tbh,

I haven't read back through yet..

Didn't win!? Shame under the circumstances but who gives a fuck, we are underdogs to all of the rest anyway.

Was there any trouble? I heard something on the radio.

[url width=634 height=389]http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/04/27/article-2315752-19838D6E000005DC-62_634x389.jpg[/url]

Lets hope so...

Jus see the goals, how the ref could give the pen I don't know, he was blind side to it and the Lino who had a perfect view gave a corner. Joke.
Still on to brentford reckon we could do em at are place, and fancy Yeovil to beat utd so think we will go up to wembly 3rd time lucky? You bet coyr get behind the team!!!

Mate of mine texted me and said there was a bit of trouble during, but mostly outside the ground.  Seems they didn't take to kindly to being relegated.

Fan got stabbed apparently according to twitter

Yeah kicked off outside. Not enough police for starts.

We seemed to want to walk the ball in the net.
Once again second half complete control. 1-0 up and should have been game over.

Trouble, pitch invasion and we lost the shape.

Outside kicking off. Dogs, horses etc. Complete shambles. Didn't let any cars leave the car park for at least 20 minutes.
Fans trying to get at each other. Some people must have been stuck for at least 45 minutes or so.
Typical modern ground with one big carpark and one exit. The "little" Police numbers to be fair done well as it could have got worse.

Any news on the person stabbed ?? I take it our fans were no saints as well.

Disappointing result, would have liked to win today to win 3 in a row...not to be! Bring on Brentford and the lottery of the play offs!!!

Going into the playoffs on the back of three good results was more important to me today. Would imagine Brentford are feeling a lot worse than us tonight so let's hope it stays that way, sometimes teams feeling sorry for themselves aren't so good at bouncing back. Hears hoping anyway !

Still bemused as to how we ended up losing 3-1. Surreal afternoon.

They came out quicker and were probably the better side for the first 15, but from then on we dominated. Played some really good stuff especially in the second half, Luongo did well and a lot of the play came through him, Roberts and Collins tore them to shreds down the left hand side on numerous occasions and their right back was awful. Far too wasteful in front of goal yet again though.

Can't blame the pitch invasion for the capitulation though. Yes the game turned after that but if we can't keep our composure then we've only got ourselves to blame. Lack of discipline I'm afraid.

All kicked off afterwards as well. Fucking loons.

I don't condone violence, but I was amused when one scunthorpe fan crept through the police lines and twatted a swindon fan before running off in a shower of retaliatory punches/kicks.

Quite a bit of amusing 'banter' as well. Guess they didn't take it too well  :bye:

Around 50% of the chants were aimed at what appeared to be a "special" home fan with a flag.  A bit cringe worthy but he brought it on himself really.

Is Gary Johnson the only play off winning manger out of the 4 sides?

Well, aren't all the other 3 in their first season of management?

No, Rosers second season at Brentford.

Can't think of Johnson winning the play offs though....

That's why I asked...

And this I why I wasn't sure..

Very unjust defeat. The pitch invasion/trouble had an effect on the players, we barely got in their half after that and we lost the shape completely.

God knows what our players would have done in the 70's and 80's then if that changed the game !

Nothing, considering most of them probably weren't born.

Are Scunthorpe our new Gillingham?

 :toughguy:

3-1 isn't unjust. Sounds like we lost our shape and composure.

You won't have to long to wait if we bomb in the play offs.

I was curious so I checked our PPG under Di Canio and subsequently and how we'd have ended the season.

Up to the Tranmere game we had a PPG of 1.81.
Subsequently we've had a PPG of 0.87.

PPG of 1.81 would have seen us finish around the 83 point mark, probably enough for the title or auto.
PPG of 0.87 would have yielded approximately 40 points so comfortably below midtable.

You can all draw your own conclusions from that.

I know it's stating the obvious but we miss Di Canio, we miss his backroom staff and we miss Matt Ritchie.

If we hadn't of lost all of the above (I suppose you could include Black in that) we'd have won the league.

The conclusion I draw from that is that you're shit at maths.

PPG since Tranmere is 1.14.

I did indeed fail GCSE maths...

Either way it's still a bit poor isn't it?

Plus Crewe and Stevenage were already on holiday.

It's over DV....time to let go, it was fun while it lasted but was never going to last.  Have you never had a bird like that?

all of them.

Then you should be used to it. Remember the good times, try and still be friends and hope they haven't had the shirt off your back.

But we couldn't afford Di Canio so it is pretty irrelevant.  A bit like going out with a Goldigger and then losing your job, it was going to end eventually.

People who haven't moved on from Super Di Canio should fuck off and support Sunderland.

This
It was always going to be when he left not IF
Leaving us mid season was pants

I was on a stag do Saturday - went to Altrinham v Droylesdon so only catching up on all the drama now. The fact Bmuff lost out on the title has made my day. Cunts.

Incidentally, Altrinham have a player called Damian Reeves, he scored 44 goals last season and is on about 37 goals this season.

Sounds as if he knows where the goal is and could be handy in a higher league?! He's looking for a league club at the moment. I wonder whether we could 'afford' a player like this?

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/damian-reeves-proves-good-goals-1766884

I see Nathan Bryne fucked up for the third goal yesterday.

He really is a concern defensively but some much needed pace in the backline for Brentford - Wright Phillips and Donaldson destroyed us last month.

Even if that were true, which it isn't as someone has already pointed out, it's so simplistic as to be utterly fucking useless as a stat.

It's seeking to draw a conclusion on a causal link between two things without considering any other factors. Important little things like:

- The players available during the two periods being compared (or are we in the DV fantasy world where if PDC had stayed all would have been well with the world, Ritchie would magically have returned on loan from Muff, the loan players that were sent back at the end of January would have been brought back and the 7/8 first teamers that have gone on the injury list would have all been fine?)
- The opposition faced - if you check 7 of our last 10/11 games were away to top 10 sides. We picked up 9 points from those games. Dicanio would have dome better? Well he hardly set the world on fire against those 7 teams at home, a return of 12 points.

There's a whole thread that I posted about this so I won't repeat it all but this is exactly the kind of simple minded comparison that made me post it in the first place.

Frankly I thought you were brighter than this?

I don't know where Altrincham is, but doesn't sound much of a stag venue! Ah, I see your link to the MEN, so I presume the stag was in Manchester!

I was also at a stag in Cologne and went to watch Cologne v 1860 Munich yesterday. The game finished 1-1 but as we were right next to the Munich fans, I sat and watched them most of the game. The atmosphere they generate is incredible, non-stop singing for 90 minutes on a terrace. The 'conductors' at the front, barely watch the game trying to generate an atmosphere, its some sight. Munich were terrible but their players must have got a right lift from it as they got an equaliser towards the end and could have won the match, even though Cologne were much the better team.

Here are some of the scenes recorded by a scunny fan.. Shocking scenes!

There were two couples next to me, both of the guys had brought their Mrs' and they were scared shitless!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImiC0pCzTpA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImiC0pCzTpA)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcJtxZsPo0I (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcJtxZsPo0I)

I've never really understood the need for all of this. Maybe I'm just a big wimp, but I've never got any pleasure is shouting obscenities, pretending to be a toughie, fighting with people or scaring people to death. Each to their own I guess.

Uncalled for. 

I'd imagine many people are of the opinion, that had PdC been manager, there's no way we'd have conceded 3 in the last few mins to a side who knew they were down, especially when there were potential advantages to us winning te game.

I don't think it proves anything (even with the maths corrected :)). I noticed a few people had mentioned in the thread that PDC staying would have meant auto-promotion and wanted to see the projected totals.

But thanks for the kind words.

You really are such a cunt.

If you really think we are equally well off or even better off now than we were under PDC then you are more of an insufferable pillock than already established.

We wouldn't have conceded 3 goals in the last 10 minutes under Di Canio, not a chance.

Kmac needs time to build his own team, we need to get behind him and the players.

I will reserve my judgement on him after the first 10-15 games of next season at the earliest.  

Not sure if its been mentioned but we have finished with the 2nd best attack (72 goals) and the best defence (39 goals) with a GD of +33. I doubt many teams have those statistics and still manage to only finish in 6th!

Oh for fuck sake! What is your point here Reg?

Sonic's post while being in the Scunthorpe thread wasn't directly about that game. In fact it makes no reference to that game whatsoever, so neither do I.  

Sonic makes a general point about performance over the period prior to and after PDC left. He implied that the difference in the points per game accrued over 3/4's of a season and over the last dozen games was about the change in manager. I have some serious doubts about that as there have been so many other factors to take into account, as posted several times before.

Your reply neatly avoids the issues that I actually posted about. So be honest. Do you really think that in the circumstances that he would have been operating in; reduced squad, increasing injury list, transfer embargo, difficult  fixture list in the run in, PDC would have managed to maintain the kind of points per game average that he'd built up over the rest of the season?
(Even if he had do you think he had some sort of magic power that would have prevented Bournemouth averaging 2.7 points per game for their final 9 games of the season?)  

As to whether the Scunthorpe result would have happened under PDC who the fuck knows? Fear of him might have kept the players more focused, but equally he could have fucking lost it during the pitch invasion, decked a Scunny fan and got himself sent to the stands,  or he could have urged the players to fight to the last, resulting in a key player getting injured. I have no frigging idea and frankly neither do you. From the way you talk it's as if we never lost an away game to a shit side under DiCanio, and we all know that's not true.

You seem to think that result is important, and I'm not sure I do. Play off place secure, opposition fans and players in a frenzy, I'm just happy that we got out of the game intact and with everyone still available for the play offs. Fuck the result of a pretty meaningless game.

When you look at the results over the season, that seems to be because we've properly hammered a lot of not very good sides, (as well as a couple of decent ones in Tranmere, and Muff), but haven't done that great home or away against most of the top sides. That's cost us in the end.

I didn't imply that at all.

My post was a overly simplistic response to the few on here who made an equally simplistic claim that if Di Canio had never left we would have been nailed on for promotion. I just happened to fuck up the maths while I was at it.

I do know, however, that we only conceded three goals in the last 15 minutes plus injury time of league games away from home during his entire time in charge.

I know you fucking hate him, but he was a good manager. And to admit this fact is not necessarily to denigrate the current incumbent.

I thought we had the best record against top 6 sides in the division before Kmac came in?  :hmmm:

While we shouldn't simplify the Di Canio v Kmac eras to PPG due to the extraneous circumstances you've mentioned, we equally shouldn't simplify the worse return in PPG as resulting from the sum of those extraneous circumstances only.

There are clear tactical differences: formation change, defensive line, work rate; that haven't worked, and have contributed as much to the dip in form as the loss of any player.

Then I can only apologise. The "you can all draw your own conclusions from that" closer had me fooled, as it's the sort of line people use when they're being a smart arse and implying that the conclusion to be drawn is obvious.

I hadn't realised that you literally meant "there's the numbers make of it what you want".

Sorry :-[

True, and your comments about the change in the defensive line in the other thread is pretty much spot on. I think some of the other criticism around formation and player position are maybe a bit unfair. The "See I told you. You should have played Devera and moved Macca into midfield 3 games ago" comments are easy to make when you don't see the players in training and have a clear picture of their level of fitness. I'm pretty sure that Devera played as soon as Mac thought he could get through 90 minutes.

And you have to allow for a new manager to get to know the team. We all know PDC's first 10 games included 5 defeats after all.

I don't hate him (don't know him), I hate some of the things he believes in. And I've been pretty clear on several threads that I think he did a good job managing the side.

[url width=235 height=240]http://i.imgur.com/ZbZlCgw.gif[/url]

My point is I don't think you should be calling into question the numerical intelligence of SY, in quite such a Govian fashion. After all SY has previously displayed the characteristics of dyscalculia, when the scoreboard operator.
 

I'd forgotten about that! You're right. Shouldn't mock the innumerate.

But I was really referring to you're segue into a critique of the last 10 minutes are Scunny, which kind of wasn't the subject I was commenting on.

This is much how I visualised what was said on the Dostoyevsky thread on Saturday night.

I'm sorry, but if anyone was scared shitless by that they must have a low shitless threshold.

I've crapped scarier stuff than that

That's what I was thinking, shouting and standing around at football matches, who'd have thought it  :no:

Its amazing how times have changed. That would have been regarded as extremely mild back in the 70s even if there were no police / stewards.

In fairness, the videos don't seem to show the worst of it - there were definitely some punches thrown and batons swung - although I take your point that the events of saturday would be regarded as mild in a 1970s context.

I doubt it. Of the top 6 sides (excluding us obviously)

Doncaster beat us at their place under KMac - Managed a draw at the CG under PDC
Bournemouth drew at home - lost heavily at the CG (both under PDC)
Brentford beat us at their place under KMac and beat us at the CG under PDC
We beat Yeovil home and away under PDC and KMac respectively
Sheff U beat us at Bramall Lane under KMac and drew at the CG under PDC
Orient got a draw at home and beat us at the CG both under PDC

So 8 games against those sides with PDC, (6 at home, just 2 away) with 2 wins, 4 draws and 2 defeats
4 under Kmac - (all away) with 1 win and 3 defeats.

That does look like a bit of a dip in form, but if you look at the games Kmac lost away, Sheff, Doncaster and Brentford, we didn't exactly shine at home against them, losing to Brentford, drawing to Sheffield and Donny.

Anyone who was scared by that has lived an extremely sheltered life. I just walked through it.

That top 6 is not the same as the top 6 Di Canio faced when in charge.

Tranmere were comfortably 1st and Stevenage comfortably 2nd in the table (and unbeaten at home in the FL) when we thumped them 5-0 and 4-0 respectively, and teams like Crawley and Franchise (who we beat 3-0 and 1-0 in our opening home fixtures) were also entrenched in the top 6 early on.

I think the only top 6 team we lost to contemporary to the time was Brentford.

I know, I thought about looking at the sides that were near the top at the time we played them, but finishing position is a much better measure of who the better sides in the division are. Anyone can be top of the league from August to October, depending on how the fixtures fall. Doesn't make you a good side.

You can't properly compare how PDC did against some shite side that finished 18th but happened to be 2nd after 6/7 games with how KMac did against a side that finished 2 after 46 games can you?

Di Canio was the best manager we ever had Lumps.

Not been supporting the club long then? And not that interested in the clubs history either clearly. "Ever" is a fucking long time for a club formed in 1879.

Sam Allen - 2 Southern League titles, 3 x SL runner up - 2 FA cup semi-finals
Danny Williams - Promotion to the 2nd Division and League Cup Double
Lou Macari - 4th Div Champion, 3rd Division Play-off winner, 2nd Division play-off semi-finalists in successive seasons
Ossie Ardiles - 2nd Division play-off winner
Glenn Hoddle - 2nd Division play-off winner

PDC might just scrape into the top 6. No bollocks I think Bert Head probably deserves it more having built the side that brought through Summerbee, Trollope, Hunt, Rogers and Smart.

Best ever. Not by a fucking long way

You watching the Villa Sunderland game tonight?

Yes he was.

Didn't even know it was on. Sort of lost interest in Prem football a few years ago. Results too predictable.

Hahahahahahahaha!

Good one.

on the phone to paddy power now, whats the score tonight please monkey?

Kind of meant the overall league rather than individual games. Someone from London or Manchester will win the league. 5 other incredibly wealthy teams I have no interest in will be squabbling at the top of the table over the remaining CL places.

Only the relegation fight has any variety from year to year and who but fans of the clubs involved can get excited by that.

Bravo, Bravo.

You fell for that Lumpy.

Sorry to be pedantic, but it was: Glenn Hoddle - 1st Division play-off winner

Truly awesome game. I loved PDCs tenure as much as anyone, but there's no way PDC taking us from L2 to L1 can compare to GH taking us into the Premiership. Not to mention all the other exploits dalumpimunki listed from various managers.

I know, I just thought in a list like that it was easier to just use the old division descriptions, to stop it being confusing.

By that system of measurement the Bournemouth, Yeovil, Walsall, and Leyton Orient teams from the first half of the season (who were all embroiled in relegation battles) are given equal weight of difficulty to face as the Bournemouth, Yeovil, Walsall, and Leyton Orient teams from the second half of the season (who were all vying for promotion and among the top form sides in the divison).

Surely you can see the flaw in using only the final league positions, irrespective of the variable form of these teams throughout the season, as the system of comparison?

We can use any measures we want.

It will still provide the same result.

Yes it will, but not solely down to Pdc versus KMac. It wasn't just the manager that changed and people need to fucking accept the other factors involved. This continual wankfest over di Canio is getting boring as fuck.

Yes loads changed we all know that. Even with all those changes PDC would have got better results. I will not apologise for rating him.

True

In the championship and in administration.

Lets make no bones about it, his petulant spending was out of control

A bit like my Mrs

...and I assume you will soon bin your mrs off for a dull, old Scottish bloke :)

Guaranteed  :D

This is simple surely? Those sides in the top six positions now, they're not just the best six sides in the division this week, they're the best six sides in the division this season. That's how leagues work. Speculation about who was in form or out of form when we played them is nothing but that.

And league position, especially early in the season is a piss poor way to judge even a teams form. In the early season in particular, it's as much about who you've played so far as how good you are. Any old shite can be top 6 in fucking September or October for chrissake. And indeed quite of lot of ropey old shite (that got found out as soon as they played anyone decent) was in the top 6 in those months (yes Stevenage I am looking at you).

Were Notts County really the best side in the league on September 8th last year? No, they were just lucky enough that in their first 5 league games of the year they played 2 of the shittest teams in the league in Hartlepool and Bury, and a fairly shit team in Shrewsbury. It takes time and games to even that stuff out.

Frankly the fact that you have used the term "fighting a relegation battle" to describe teams that were in the lower half of the league 5 or 6 weeks after the start of the season should be a clue that there's something seriously flawed with your line of argument.

None of those sides were fighting a relegation battle this season because relegation and the battles to avoid them happen at the end of a season by fucking definition.

There's a reason the prizes are handed out at the end of the season. It's because at that point, when everyone has played everyone home and away, is when you can judge who is good and who is shit.

Here's a turn up. I think you're probably right!

I've never argued that the managerial change was a positive thing in terms of results. I think the other factors were already having an impact on performance before PDC left, and would have continued to, meaning that I don't think he would have got the sort PPG he was getting earlier in the season.

However, I think it would be mad to think that throwing the established coaching order up in the air at a crucial point of the season, wouldn't have a negative effect. PDC knew the players, they knew his style of play. Chances are we would have done a bit better with him still in place.

That doesn't necessarily mean he's a better coach or manager than Mac, because if the positions had been reversed and it was Macdonald that had built the side his way and had quit and PDC taking over late in the season. I think that might have had an equally negative impact.

I agree with sentence one, paragraph 1 and paragraph 2.

Cant say I agree with paragraph 3 thought - although that is based purely on the fact since he took over at Sunderland (and someone elses team obviously) he's managed to get them to give Chelsea a good go and he's beat Newcastle and Everton with a team who previously managed to only just scrape a draw against a 10 man Norwich side who played for a point.

Slightly different situation though isn't it. They were in free fall, on a really crap run of form. They properly needed a change.

I'm just saying that if we'd had the season we'd had up to the end of January under any manager, I wouldn't have wanted to change things for the run in, even if Pep Guardiola fancied the job, let alone Paolo .

Stevenage were not just 'ropey old shite' at the beginning of the season who were only at the top because of some astonishingly fortunate run of games against teams at the bottom.

They played and beat Walsall, Yeovil, Franchise and Leyton Orient in that period (all top teams according to a system that ranks by final league position) and also played and drew against Doncaster, Bournemouth and Tranmere to get to 2nd place in the first half of the season, before a terrible collapse in form in the second half when they lost to the likes of Bury, Carlisle, Scunthorpe, Oldham and Colchester (some of the poorest teams according to a system that ranks by final league position).

Bournemouth, Yeovil, Walsall, and Leyton Orient meanwhile really were 'ropey old shite' at the bottom of the table when we played them first time around but by diametrical contrast all had a drastic turnaround in form for the second time we played them and ended up finishing near the top.

Saying that beating those teams in the first part of the season is commensurate to beating them in the second half of the season based on a blind reading of their end league position is not just an oversimplification of the reality of how good or bad those teams were at different points in the season but a logical fallacy that makes for a very unfair comparison.

In fact it would be making almost exactly the same logical fallacy that trying to make a blind comparison between the PPG of Di Canio and Kmac without considering the extraneous circumstances of the resources they had available would be making: assuming that two teams in two different times and places were of equal ability and skill.

:toocool:

All irrelevant - He's fucked off and taken his mates with him.

We have Kevin McDonald in charge now.

I don't give a fuck about statistics. But tonight, I am a Villa fan!

Villa dicking them 4-1.

Spot on....we would be up now and saving lots of dosh on the lottery that is the playoffs.

For the first time in years i cannot wait for this season to finish..........it has fucked me right off how the last few weeks has panned out.

I didn't think Doss was Scottish  :hmmm:

You need to pick a line of argument and stick to it. You can't in the same post argue that Stevenage were a good side early in the season because they beat Orient, Yeovil, MK and Walsall, and then a paragraph later argue that Yeovil, Orient and Walsall were all shit early in the season.

I'm not attempting to argue that teams don't have changes in form over the course of the season, and that there are times to play them when they represent more of a challenge. I just have no idea how you would factor that into any sort of a comparison of performance. Because league position alone, when you're comparing early season with late season form just isn't a good measure.

The only way I can tell how good a side is is by seeing them play a few times against a range of opposition, or by looking at a league table at the end of a season.

I wasn't arguing Stevenage were a good side early on in the season because they beat Orient, Yeovil, Franchise and Walsall. I was arguing by a system you've been advocating (which I consider erroneous) that ranks the quality of opposition primarily by final league position all those teams they beat WOULD very much be considered 'decent,' in response to your quote:


They didn't get 'found out' as soon as they played anyone decent. They played good teams in that period and matched or bettered them. Then they went on a horrible run of form during which they lost without prejudice to relative form or league position.

The reality is Stevenage were one of the best teams in the division at the time we faced them in the season, irrespective of the pains we could go to to diminish their quality retrospectively by quoting out of context the end result of their subsequent dip in form, and Bournemouth were one of the worst teams in the division at the time we faced them, irrespective of the pains we could also go to to rate them retrospectively as one of the best due to eventually finishing 2nd.

There's a chance (as with last time we discussed statistics) that we're both arguing almost the same thing again: that a direct statistical comparison of the two regimes requires such a nebulous effort of contrivance as to make it almost utterly redundant. But as with last time, I can't see the worth in attempting to fight redundant statistical analysis with further redundant statistical analysis.

He got a fucking good result last night didn't he?

But KMac would have got better results that PdC if he had been in charge at the start of the season.

I have no reason to believe this, but its as provable as your statement.

I loved PdC until about November, then he turned into a stroppy five year old who was very obviously acting for himself and not the wider good of the club and after that I was very meh.

Anyway I just don't get the love in about a man who took us to the brink of admin and then walked out at the first available opportunity when it looked like someone was going to take his toys away. Jed and co (who I am still extremely wary of - where are the answers Jedders?) are alleged to have taken £200k out of the club and there is uproar, Di Canio and Spencer take possibly at least double that and he is the best thing we ever had.

Couldnt have put it better myself.

Completely agree with this, very well put sir.

There is a difference between board sanctioned spending on the understanding a benefactor is payrolling it, and alleged self sanctioned spending against what appear to be a backdrop of cash tight times. Particularly when it is alleged one of the spends is to a consultancy that is linked to a board member.

I should point out in interests of the TEF the allegations were denied in the strongest possibly worded tweets of 140 characters or fewer.

Black took us close to administration, Paolo spent what he could. That's not his fault. he is a total und utter ladies front bottom for walking away when he did though.

Paolo and Spencer spent way too much on players but every manager if they had the chance would do exactly the same. Look at Redknapp at Pompey, Storey and Gydamek didn't put a stop to it until it was too late, the people at the top are the people ultimately responsible.

If it wasn't for Black we wouldn't be in League 1 and in the play offs, if he decided to walk in 2011 after we got relegated fuck knows where we'd be now but a part of me will always think where we'd be if he just hung on a few months until the end of the season.

No but 1.5pts per game against Villa, Chelsea, Newcastle and Everton ain't too shabby.

I'd be very pleased if KMac's next job is managing a premiership club (not its under 14s) - but hopefully he won't have to move on to achieve this.